DebianDog Sid (without systemd) + build system (mklive-sid)

[dcung]

I thought to refresh my sid builds and report.

I downloaded the latest mklive-sid.2023-10-07 from first post (and using latest online conf files - downloaded locally).
Started with openbox DE.
I haven't tested other DE builds. Just checking if anyone else got the same error or just my config.

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./mklive-sid.2023-10-07 -cli openbox_lx.conf 2>&1 | tee openbox_lx.log

Code: Select all

[0;36mInstall keyboard-configuration and more required packages[0m
Reading package lists...
Building dependency tree...
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 libelogind-compat : Conflicts: libsystemd0
E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
environment: line 70: wget: command not found
E: gnupg, gnupg2 and gnupg1 do not seem to be installed, but one of them is required for this operation
Hit:2 http://dl.google.com/linux/chrome/deb stable InRelease
Get:1 https://github.com/doglinux/sidog/raw/master/amd64 ./ InRelease [2301 B]
Hit:3 http://deb.debian.org/debian sid InRelease
Hit:4 http://snapshot.debian.org/archive/debian/20230926 sid InRelease
Fetched 2301 B in 1s (2585 B/s)
Reading package lists...
[0;36mChecking packages . . .[0m
Reading package lists...
Building dependency tree...
dash is already the newest version (0.5.12-6).
mawk is already the newest version (1.3.4.20230808-1).
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 polkitd : Depends: default-logind or
                    logind
E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
[0;31mSorry, there are one or more errors, see above.[0m
[0;31mCould be a typo in a package name.[0m
[0;36mExiting . . .[0m
[0;36mUnmounting mount binds in chroot[0m

[fredx181]

@dcung
Yes, I can confirm, the 'trick' to avoid systemd (replacing by elogind) appears to be fragile.
Few days ago I tested and it was ok, so some recent package change from Debian is probably the cause.
Will search for a fix and get back later.

[fredx181]

Problem of build failure (due to conflict elogind<>systemd) should be fixed now.
(added new elogind packages (and related), that I took from Devuan, to custom repository).
Hopefully now this fix will last (I'd give it a good score if it works for more than half a year )

[dcung]

Problem of build failure (due to conflict elogind<>systemd) should be fixed now.
...

I refresh my sid builds (with and w/o systemd), and they are okay.
Thanks Fred!

[bobol]

Dear @fredx181
would it be possible to make a customizable mklive-sid for example choice of kernel release with also choice not to include the kernel (for example if we want to keep the old one to save time)
Yesterday I created a sid minimal xfce4 I had a bug with X11, I switch to a build full, I then managed to solve the same problem, today I want to rebuild the previous build and in the meantime the kernel bug or something with the wifi. I think they're tweaking...

Same problem with mklive-bookworm

Maybe by -cli !

Is it possible ?

[fredx181]

would it be possible to make a customizable mklive-sid for example choice of kernel release with also choice not to include the kernel (for example if we want to keep the old one to save time)

The script is already very complex, so I don't really feel for adding such options.
But I can probably give some help how you could not to include the kernel by editing the script yourself, if that would be useful.
For the kernel I'd like to keep the 'Sid" version but there are always tricks of course to swap it with an earlier kernel version, e.g. from a Bookworm build.

[bobol]

Thank's for your reply @fredx181 ,
I'm going to try your advice, I'll come back if I fail...
see you later !

[fredx181]

@bobol
What I would do to skip the kernel install is to comment out line 1250 and 1251, so becomes:

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# [ "$ARCH" = "i386" ] && apt-get -o dir::cache::archives="/tmp/tmpapt" install -d linux-image-686-pae -y
# [ "$ARCH" = "amd64" ] && apt-get -o dir::cache::archives="/tmp/tmpapt" install -d linux-image-amd64 -y

Then just ignore the error messages that will appear later (and the initrd1.xz created cannot be used) and the script will finish creating 01-filesystem.squashfs (I tested and works).

Btw, about the X problem with minimal xfce4 you wrote about, it could help if you replace the BASE_INSTALL section with the (much more) packages from a full build config.
(or instead, perhaps add more xserver-xorg-video-.... packages)

EDIT: @ALL the addition of the snapshot.debian repo can make the build taking much longer (specially at the point of updating the package lists, as it has some limit on download speed).
Once running the system from the new build, you may want to disable snapshot.debian repo by removing it from /etc/apt/sources.list and do apt update , then it will probably run much faster.

As I said the snapshot.debian is a savior for when building with mklive-sid for in case suddenly some package(s) has been removed from the standard Sid repo (so that the build doesn't fail).
Then in time, perhaps there may be some issues because of that, but that's up to the user to try solving on a running system though (as sid is the 'unstable' branch).

[bobol]

Thanks a lot @fredx181
So I'm going to be able to improve my goal, which is to have a pleasant desktop, to get off to a good start... right now I'm with bookworm amd64 systemd xfce, I'll use it to sid with your method
Many thanks, I'm just starting out and I hope to be able to start programming in 2024...

in fact the problem was for plank, who didn't want to because he would only accept the X11 the environment and my was tty

Code: Select all

echo $XDG_SESSION_TYPE

so I had to add
export XDG_SESSION_TYPE=X11
to my .xinitrc

It's a pleasure to read you again !

[fredx181]

There was a problem installing elogind, libelogind0 (tested yesterday) when running the mlkive-sid build system without systemd (elogind is the replacement for systemd, it's similar to how Devuan works to avoid systemd).
Fixed now, by making these packages from custom sid repo override the standard (debian) elogind related packages and building should work OK again now.

[dcung]

There was a problem installing elogind, libelogind0 (tested yesterday) when running the mlkive-sid build system without systemd (elogind is the replacement for systemd, it's similar to how Devuan works to avoid systemd).
Fixed now, by making these packages from custom sid repo override the standard (debian) elogind related packages and building should work OK again now.

I just refreshed my Sid ISO set (7 x64 & 3 i386) today.

All the x64 builds are okay.
All the i386 builds completed (DDOG, DDOG-sd, JWM), ISO created, but missing the kernel squashfs file.

Disclaimer Note - I used my automated edited original script (2023-10-07) that put the usual - no pause, password, etc.
Script Last used sid-2023-10-12 - successful without issue - with local conf files.

I checked the logs and it has this - approx where the kernel file is being created.

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[0;36mCreating kernel .squashfs isodata/live/k-.squashfs . . .[0m
SYNTAX:mksquashfs source1 source2 ...  dest [options] [-e list of exclude
dirs/files]

Filesystem build options:
-comp <comp>		select <comp> compression
			Compressors available:
				gzip (default)
				lzma
				lzo
				lz4
				xz
				zstd
-b <block_size>		set data block to <block_size>.  Default 128 Kbytes
			Optionally a suffix of K or M can be given to specify
			Kbytes or Mbytes respectively
-reproducible		build images that are reproducible (default)
-not-reproducible	build images that are not reproducible
-mkfs-time <time>	set mkfs time to <time> which is an unsigned int
-fstime <time>		synonym for mkfs-time
-all-time <time>	set all inode times to <time> which is an unsigned int
-no-exports		don't make the filesystem exportable via NFS
-no-sparse		don't detect sparse files
-no-xattrs		don't store extended attributes
-xattrs			store extended attributes (default)
-noI			do not compress inode table
-noId			do not compress the uid/gid table (implied by -noI)
-noD			do not compress data blocks
-noF			do not compress fragment blocks
-noX			do not compress extended attributes
-no-fragments		do not use fragments
-always-use-fragments	use fragment blocks for files larger than block size
-no-duplicates		do not perform duplicate checking
-all-root		make all files owned by root
-root-mode <mode>	set root directory permissions to octal <mode>
-force-uid <uid>	set all file uids to <uid>
-force-gid <gid>	set all file gids to <gid>
-nopad			do not pad filesystem to a multiple of 4K
-keep-as-directory	if one source directory is specified, create a root
			directory containing that directory, rather than the
			contents of the directory

Filesystem filter options:
-p <pseudo-definition>	Add pseudo file definition
-pf <pseudo-file>	Add list of pseudo file definitions
			Pseudo definitions should be of the format
				filename d mode uid gid
				filename m mode uid gid
				filename b mode uid gid major minor
				filename c mode uid gid major minor
				filename f mode uid gid command
				filename s mode uid gid symlink
-sort <sort_file>	sort files according to priorities in <sort_file>.  One
			file or dir with priority per line.  Priority -32768 to
			32767, default priority 0
-ef <exclude_file>	list of exclude dirs/files.  One per line
-wildcards		Allow extended shell wildcards (globbing) to be used in
			exclude dirs/files
-regex			Allow POSIX regular expressions to be used in exclude
			dirs/files

Filesystem append options:
-noappend		do not append to existing filesystem
-root-becomes <name>	when appending source files/directories, make the
			original root become a subdirectory in the new root
			called <name>, rather than adding the new source items
			to the original root

Mksquashfs runtime options:
-version		print version, licence and copyright message
-exit-on-error		treat normally ignored errors as fatal
-recover <name>		recover filesystem data using recovery file <name>
-no-recovery		don't generate a recovery file
-quiet			no verbose output
-info			print files written to filesystem
-no-progress		don't display the progress bar
-progress		display progress bar when using the -info option
-processors <number>	Use <number> processors.  By default will use number of
			processors available
-mem <size>		Use <size> physical memory.  Currently set to 1447M
			Optionally a suffix of K, M or G can be given to specify
			Kbytes, Mbytes or Gbytes respectively

Miscellaneous options:
-root-owned		alternative name for -all-root
-offset <offset>	Skip <offset> bytes at the beginning of <dest>.
			Optionally a suffix of K, M or G can be given to specify
			Kbytes, Mbytes or Gbytes respectively.
			Default 0 bytes.
-o <offset>		synonym for -offset
-noInodeCompression	alternative name for -noI
-noIdTableCompression	alternative name for -noId
-noDataCompression	alternative name for -noD
-noFragmentCompression	alternative name for -noF
-noXattrCompression	alternative name for -noX

-Xhelp			print compressor options for selected compressor

Compressors available and compressor specific options:
	gzip (default)
	  -Xcompression-level <compression-level>
		<compression-level> should be 1 .. 9 (default 9)
	  -Xwindow-size <window-size>
		<window-size> should be 8 .. 15 (default 15)
	  -Xstrategy strategy1,strategy2,...,strategyN
		Compress using strategy1,strategy2,...,strategyN in turn
		and choose the best compression.
		Available strategies: default, filtered, huffman_only,
		run_length_encoded and fixed
	lzma (no options)
	lzo
	  -Xalgorithm <algorithm>
		Where <algorithm> is one of:
			lzo1x_1
			lzo1x_1_11
			lzo1x_1_12
			lzo1x_1_15
			lzo1x_999 (default)
	  -Xcompression-level <compression-level>
		<compression-level> should be 1 .. 9 (default 8)
		Only applies to lzo1x_999 algorithm
	lz4
	  -Xhc
		Compress using LZ4 High Compression
	xz
	  -Xbcj filter1,filter2,...,filterN
		Compress using filter1,filter2,...,filterN in turn
		(in addition to no filter), and choose the best compression.
		Available filters: x86, arm, armthumb, powerpc, sparc, ia64
	  -Xdict-size <dict-size>
		Use <dict-size> as the XZ dictionary size.  The dictionary size
		can be specified as a percentage of the block size, or as an
		absolute value.  The dictionary size must be less than or equal
		to the block size and 8192 bytes or larger.  It must also be
		storable in the xz header as either 2^n or as 2^n+2^(n+1).
		Example dict-sizes are 75%, 50%, 37.5%, 25%, or 32K, 16K, 8K
		etc.
	zstd
	  -Xcompression-level <compression-level>
		<compression-level> should be 1 .. 22 (default 15)
[0;36mCreating isodata/live/01-filesystem.squashfs...[0m
Parallel mksquashfs: Using 4 processors
Creating 4.0 filesystem on isodata/live/01-filesystem.squashfs, block size 131072.

[fredx181]

*** mklive-sid build script updated ***, download at : first post
====================================================================================================================

...
All the i386 builds completed (DDOG, DDOG-sd, JWM), ISO created, but missing the kernel squashfs file.
...

Yes, I tested now a i386 build and can confirm, thanks again.
Strange... the extracted linux-image .deb for 686 (32-bit) contains usr/lib/modules/... (not expected) and the amd64 .deb has lib/modules/... , so that's why the 686 kernel .squashfs creating failed.
(don't know if this is a mistake from the Debian kernel packager, or perhaps new "usr-merge" policy (but why then only for the 686 kernel ) )

Anyway,
Fixed by checking where the kernel modules are located in extracted linux-image .deb (usr/lib/modules/.. or lib/modules/...)
@dcung the change is the block (starting with L_IMG=....) just above : ############ End of installing packages ############

[dcung]

*** mklive-sid build script updated ***, download at : first post
====================================================================================================================

Anyway,
Fixed by checking where the kernel modules are located in extracted linux-image .deb (usr/lib/modules/.. or lib/modules/...)
@dcung the change is the block (starting with L_IMG=....) just above : ############ End of installing packages ############

Reflected the changes.
Redo the Sid refresh, all good now.
Thank you.

[fredx181]

Today I tried to upgrade all packages (apt upgrade) on my Sid build I made earlier this year. It failed badly (lots of package were "held" and I couldn't make them "upgrade", tried with aptitude too (as it's able to search for solutions) but no luck).
Reason is the big transition for Debian Sid, see more info: viewtopic.php?p=116856#p116856 and about "64bit-time": https://wiki.debian.org/ReleaseGoals/64bit-time

The good news is that making a new build with mklive-sid went well for me (includes all those new "lib*t64" packages).

[fredx181]

*** Updated SID build system (mklive-sid) ***
New attached mklive-sid at first post
Same as for mklive-bookworm and mklive-trixie there was a possible problem with installing the debootstrap package, fixed by making it install a slightly older version, v1.0.134 .

[dcung]

Hi @fredx181

It's my habit that whenever I see you update mklive script, I refresh my ISO(s) set.
I saw that my last refesh was 2024-03-31 - my usual marathon modified script made a bunch of ISOs.
And it was using debootstrap_1.0.134_all.deb (which was latest at the time), since I did cut/paste your code to use latest debootstrap to all my modified script.

Now you hardcoded debootstrap_1.0.134_all.deb, due to latest debootstrap issue.
And to follow, and I also reflected the hardcoded to all my modified mklive-script.

Now, I don't use sid often.
My marathon script just finished, and I saw some errors - but only for systemd build iso. Others are okay.
I saw the thread title "DebianDog Sid (without systemd) + build system (mklive-sid)", and thought, okay - that's expected then.
But I saw that my last refresh set has systemd ISOs. (My modified script denotes them with -sd prefixes).

Have I been making SID systemd build when I shouldn't all this time?
If so, I can see why I did. Because the original script (GUI) has/allow for systemd option (ticked box).
And I have been 're-using' conf files from other mklive, so SYSTEMD flag was carried over.
It has been 'successful' to-date (i.e. my last refresh).

Anyway - I thought to ask you whether we can or can't make systemd in Sid builds.
And then modify my refresh set list accordingly.

In case sid build can have systemd, attached are the log files.

[fredx181]

@dcung Thanks ! It is supported to make a sid systemd build (if all is well of course )
Been a while back since I tested building with systemd for sid.
The error you got is not caused by the debootstrap version change, it's that newer systemd related packages conflict now with some other packages that are in the base install list.
These packages are: insserv rcconf startpar sysv-rc .
So removing these from your .conf at BASE_INSTALL=.... section should fix it.
I've removed them already now in the online configs for sid and trixie, btw.

I found out about this by using aptitude (trying to resolve dependencies, conflicts), attached mklive-sid-mod (experimental), perhaps helpful for you too in case something like this happens again in the future.
(will switch to using aptitude instead of exiting if checking packages failed)

mklive-sid-mod.gz

Remove fake .gz and make executable

(69.63 KiB) Downloaded 30 times

Using mklive-sid-mod, only if the above mentioned packages are still part of BASE_INSTALL=... in your .conf, checking packages will fail (on systemd build), and then, to continue, not exit, aptitude will run instead of apt-get.

After a couple of solutions that I refused, this one worked for me:

Code: Select all

The following actions will resolve these dependencies:

     Install the following packages:                      
1)     libgail18t64 [2.24.33-4 (unstable)]                

     Keep the following packages at their current version:
2)     insserv [Not Installed]                            
3)     libgail18 [Not Installed]                          
4)     rcconf [Not Installed]                             
5)     startpar [Not Installed]                           
6)     sysv-rc [Not Installed]  

[dcung]

...
So removing these from your .conf at BASE_INSTALL=.... section should fix it.
I've removed them already now in the online configs for sid and trixie, btw.
...

Thanks.
I've removed them now from my local configs for sid.
mklive now completed successfully, but...
when I tested the build, it's stuck during booting...some systemd stuff...(1 of 4)...looping 1 thru 4...and said no (time) limit - forever (?)
So I waited some 4 minutes before hitting power button and retried. And it's stuck at the same place..but this time it said (1 of 3).
Maybe if I tried it 4 times it will boot (?)
FYI - I have not tried it on other computer...just this one. Maybe you can make some sense of what's happening.

IMG_20240623_075902-1.jpg (93.41 KiB) Viewed 1394 times

[dcung]

I have just tested DDOG non-systemd build with updated conf files.
Not sure if it's related, but also stuck during boot...
I have retried/poweroff few times, stuck at same place (pic) below.

IMG_20240623_084355-1.jpg (53.26 KiB) Viewed 1388 times

.
.
.
But...
As I am typing this post (on different lappy)..., it boots...(Fujitsu-i5 beside)
I'm a slow typist...so...maybe after after 5 mins or so it booted completely.

But....( )
When I shutdown/reboot...it's stuck here...

IMG_20240623_085638-1.jpg (81.24 KiB) Viewed 1388 times

.
.
.
When I finish typing all this...it was still at same point...so I hit power button.

Ok...that's it. Report for the day.
I just thought to report it, in case it's all related.
Note - it's done on the same laptop - Fujitsu i5 - my mklive build machine...

[fredx181]

Hi @dcung Strange .... I cannot reproduce any of the problems you have, sorry.
Just now made 2 test builds (systemd and no-systemd) with the default package listing for DDog DE, booting and rebooting went all fine.

So I can only guess what's causing the problem for you, may have to do with the mods you possibly? made in mklive-sid or/and your custom .conf. Or perhaps your laptop doesn't like the newer kernel.
If you want to investigate further, perhaps you can try exactly what I did and see what happens. Or post your custom .conf so I can test with that.

EDIT: Tested now also booting the 2 builds on my old HP laptop from 2007 (previous test was on a modern ASUS laptop) and all works fine too.
Well... except that the xfce4-panel disappears at start, but that's another issue (I found what's causing it and will fix soon)

[dcung]

Hi @dcung Strange .... I cannot reproduce any of the problems you have, sorry.
...

I was in bed already...but reading this, I wouldn't be able to sleep unless I test it tonight...

Anyway...You're right.
I just tested the same builds on another laptop. I use a Samsung NP740xxx this time.
Both (systemd and no-systemd) are booting/restarting okay w/o problem.
So, it is the Fujitsu that is 'fussy'...

I will try again with more laptops tomorrow...now I can sleep. Thanks and sorry to waste your time.

2024-06-23-105121_1920x1080_scrot-1.png (403.14 KiB) Viewed 1336 times

[dcung]

...
Or perhaps your laptop doesn't like the newer kernel.
...

I tested 2 more laptops. So these
- Samsung NP740xx i5
- Dell D630 T8300 (nVidia GPU)
- Dell Vostro 1510 T7500 (Intel GPU)
Works with new Sid builds, both systemd and no-systemd.
So, the problem seems to only effect my Fujitsu-i5.

I don't really use Sid. Merely collecting/hoarding ISOs.
But curiosity drives me to find out further.

I don't really have lots of mods to the local conf, but obviously this is one to eliminate as possible problem.

I build 2 builds, systemd and no-systemd with unmodified online conf and unmodified mklive-sid.
It shows the same symptoms.

I would have said something if I found it in my earlier 'refresh'.
I went back to my 'hoarding' collection.

Refresh from 2024-02-01 works fine -> k-6.6.13-amd64
Refresh from 2024-03-31 works fine -> k-6.7.9-amd64

Current Refresh 2024-06-23 does not work -> k-6.8.12-amd64
Works if you swap kernel from earlier refresh.

So, it's kernel related issue.
I just put a note for myself that this refresh set, doesn't work in Fujitu w/o kernel swap.

@fredx181 Thanks for spending time to assist me getting to 'bottom' of it.

[fredx181]

*** mklive-sid build script updated ***, download at : first post
Changes:
- similar fix as done for mklive-trixie: viewtopic.php?p=126444#p126444
- and the Devuan "ceres" repo (Devuan equivalent of Sid) has most priority now, but only in case systemd-boot is NOT selected from the settings

[fredx181]

*** mklive-sid build script updated ***, download at : first post
Changes:
Added option(s) to build with LXQT Desktop:

Edit:
Some workarounds:
- the Devuan "ceres" repo is activated, this is to support building without systemd (this is only in case running with systemd is not chosen from settings)
- the "snapshot.debian.org" repo is activated (date: 2024-08-23) , to support installing packages that possibly had been removed from the standard Debian Sid repo.