Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

ALPHA
this is imppup / indripup built using ubuntus impish indri packages.

what's new?

vidcutter: a video clipper/editor. this isn't kdenlive but is quick and actually really useful for clipping sections out of video. you can also edit with it but clips need to be the same dimensions as it does no conversion. so random clips off youtube is a NO, but editing lots of different clips from your phone or camera (provided you record with same settings) YES.

minder: a mind mapping application. quite simple and neat.

zensound: @vovchiks puppyfied binaural beats. we also keep his haiku-bash.

jwmdesk-3.1: @radkys new and improved jwmdesk

diffuse: beediff has been ditched for a more competent merge tool.

pulseaudio: i kind of hate to do it but pulseaudio is required for lots of steam games now and i want people to be able to game with puppy OTB. (don't worry you can still turn it off and have retrovol/alsa)

blueman: janky_bt has gone but because we are using pulseaudio we can now use blueman for bluetooth and it seems just as janky as janky_bt

btop: not sure if it will stay but it's an alternative to htop.

plus all the latest woofce improvements.
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what's wrong? (you tell me)

kernel staying at 5.4 for now as anything newer will not boot on my rizen in impish. newer kernels boot in fossapup so i think there's some issue with xorg nouveau stuff (in fact i know there is as some strange goings on )

deadbeef staying at 1.8.4 as the newer ones were playing up.

Theming isn't done yet so don't worry about the green ........ although people did get used to the pink

also i'm undecided whether it will be imppup or indripup ..... what do you think?
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download here http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/test/imp/iso/

and fossapups 32bit compatibility sfs seems to work if you need it

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:02 pm

pulseaudio: i kind of hate to do it but pulseaudio is required for lots of steam games now and i want people to be able to game with puppy OTB.

I have exactly the same feelings

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:02 pm

also i'm undecided whether it will be imppup or indripup ..... what do you think?

This is a very difficult question Well, probably indripup, because I will most likely draw ASCII graphics for the console and I need a specific beast.

Will there be a transition to GTK4?

Grey wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:12 pm

Will there be a transition to GTK4?

we've only just gone to gtk3

gtk4 is probably just one single button for everything

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 6:25 pm

we've only just gone to gtk3

I asked just in case. Ubuntu and Gnome switched to 4. Personally, I don't need it

Do not misunderstand me.

Any new version of Puppy you produce is good for Puppy Linux.
I look forward to using it.

But as I read about Ubuntu Impish Indri.
It seems to be a short term build.
Life span supported for 9 months until July 2022.

Ubuntu Focal Fossa is still going to be supported until April 2025.

I suggest you try to work up a newer version of Fossapup64 9.5
With installed program changes or updates to them.
Especially updates to programs like Frugalpup Installer (now v35), UExctract, etc.....
Definitely all the bug fixes that Quickpet->Info->Fossapup updates has provided.
Even the changes to installed programs that you have decided to make with imppup / indripup 64bit.
Definitely having all the latest changes that are in Woof-CE.
Having the very latest firmware package, you can find, to provide needed firmware.
Maybe call it Fossapup64 10.0, Fossapupnew64 10.0, Fossapupimproved64 10.0, Fossapupupdate64 10.0, etc..........

kernel staying at 5.4 for now as anything newer will not boot on my rizen in impish. newer kernels boot in fossapup so i think there's some issue with xorg nouveau stuff (in fact i know there is as some strange goings on

If you stick to improving Fossapup64.
By what you say, a much newer kernel could be used.
I see posts where people are trying to use Puppy Linux on very new hardware.
A newer Linux kernel is going to be needed to support the newest hardware.
I have gotten Fossapup64 supporting very new hardware just by changing to a newer kernel.
Well, a Linux kernel ability, is very much about how kernel got configured, when it was compiled.
ozsouth seems good at coming up with Linux Kernels for Puppy Linux.
viewforum.php?f=65

I noticed two things.
Scrolling through tabs with the mouse wheel doesn't seem to work (which works in Fossapup ).
Qemu 6.1.0 is not installed from PPM. After downloading it manually from ibiblio and unpacking it, there is no qemu_gui script in it.

Grey wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:19 pm

I noticed two things.
Scrolling through tabs with the mouse wheel doesn't seem to work (which works in Fossapup ).
Qemu 6.1.0 is not installed from PPM. After downloading it manually from ibiblio and unpacking it, there is no qemu_gui script in it.

qemu_gui is part of woofce and is in all newer pups /usr/bin/qemu_gui

Grey wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:19 pm

Scrolling through tabs with the mouse wheel doesn't seem to work (which works in Fossapup ).

It's a GTK+ 3 thing - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/-/issues/234

hI @bigpup
Isn't this distro (and 'IMP...') a kind of 'interom' release of Ubuntu? It is the stage that will be foundational to the next "long term release".

Correct me if I am wrong.

@Grey, yes, GTK4 is directional as Linux distros are now moving on that path; ARch, too, for example. I believe this was discussed on Puppy's GIT awhile back.

• Question: Are you having problem(s) using QEMU after the initial click and the message it produces?

@666philb, VERY NICE. I merely downloaded the ISO file to the SG2D USB and booted this to desktop. So, far so good on its maiden voyage.

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:02 pm

... also i'm undecided whether it will be imppup or indripup ..... what do you think?
o
o
o
btop: not sure if it will stay but it's an alternative to htop.

• I think "impPUP64" or "ImpishPUP64" would ID this distro.

• BTOP is a step up from htop with more meaningful system information

One thing of notice is that, for some reason, this now takes a lot longer to boot via the ISO file than, say, FossaPUP64 (it seems to be unnecessarily long). Not exactly sure why? Yet, and most importantly, there are NO boot errors as it boots directly to desktop.

Media files play without issue.

After Further testing

• I had posted earlier about an issue On this pristine boot where it appears I could NOT click any of the checkboxes in FirstRUN (aks 'Quicksetup'). But, have since discovered that it is merely the GTK theme that is used initially. It is so light on my monitor that I could not tell if it was being selected or not. It just looked 'white' to my old eyes. There is NOTHING wrong with FirstRUN.

• I also had posted about a message that, I THOUGHT is unique in PUPs. I was wrong as I've just discovered the same behavior in Slacko64 v8.2.1. I mount one partition on the drive. Once complete, I click the drive icon to un-mount. This message pops. I had no intention of disabling SWAP to un-mount the single partition. I tried the "X" and it unmounted. I remounted and tried unmount again, this time selecting "Dismiss". BOTH, Seems to not impact the un-mount as the partition was indicated not mounted, but was a surprise.

  

  Is this message necessary.png (58.08 KiB) Viewed 8187 times

These behaviors are NOT a BUG/ERROR!

System was shutdown and restarted in several states: namely few times saving sessions and others in pristine states. All perform as expected from PUPs! Great

Final testings, shows "No Problem Found"

@666philb, this may be what @Grey was referencing?

An issue attempting to add QEMU to the system via the PPM. I get the following 2 screens on an install attempt.

P.S. The PPM was updated BEFORE attempting to add the QEMU shown.

yes none of the pets are in the PPM at the moment
qemu can be found here http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/test/imp/

666philb wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 12:09 pm

qemu can be found here http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/test/imp/

Qemu 6.1.0 from ibiblio works. Someone "very lazy" used libvirglrenderer.so.1.4.2 in it, most likely from Qemu 5.1.0 In Fossapup I have Qemu 6.1.0 contains libvirglrenderer.so.1.5.4.

@666philb I applaud "BTOP" which you have in this distro. Its beautiful in how it expands/contract according to user drag on terminal edges. So much useful infomation as well as management usability.

Hope others have taken a moment to review & comment.

Request
I ask because this supports the features already within your distro: Could/would you consider adding a couple of @ETP's contributions (which I wish was in the WoofCE builds for all PUPs) as they improve common user system assistance? These have provided useful info for several years, so, by now, are 'battle tested'; namely

1. Conky Toggle

2. Net-Info which will alert if the internet disappears for any reason as well as alert when it returns.

So far,at this stage of development, this distro is stable, fast, and complete for an OOTB experience. Everything I have thrown at it just works!

Thanks, again.

hI @bigpup
Isn't this distro (and 'IMP...') a kind of 'interom' release of Ubuntu? It is the stage that will be foundational to the next "long term release".

Correct me if I am wrong.

Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri) Beta
It is kind of their test version to see how new features, programs, newer core Linux files and programs, etc..... work in the real world.
Who knows what will actually go into Ubuntu 22.04 LTS.

Puppy Linux really does not care to follow what Ubuntu wants to do with their OS.

666philb can correct me if I am wrong.
Puppy only uses the specific Ubuntu OS repository, as a source for core Linux OS files and programs.
Ones used by every Linux OS.

Better to base Puppy on the next LTS version of Ubuntu.
With the Ubuntu 22.04 LTS, those core files may be the same or may be different.
But one thing will be available from 22.04 LTS repository.
A lot of software programs compiled for it.
Why, because it will be around for at least 5 years.
If Puppy is using the same core Linux OS files and programs.
The stuff in the Ubuntu 22.04 repository will probably run in that Puppy version.
That repository will be good to use for 5 years or more.

Ubuntu 22.04 is not built yet, so can not use stuff from it.

But Ubuntu focal fossa is still very active and being updated by Ubuntu.
It's repository is actively getting updated with new software.
Latest version:
ubuntu-20.04.3-desktop-amd64.iso release date:2021-08-19
You can see it has had 3 updates to the original release.

Hello bigpup
I think what you are asking for is not feasible in the Puppy system. Short explanation...
It would be too much work to produce an updated Fossapup that was 100% compatible with existing savefiles. Users would have to start again with a new savefile and reconfigure their Puppy again. That is not something Puppy users like doing.

Ubuntu has an extensive configuration management process that maintains consistency over several variants at once.
Typically the 20.04.1 version will be 100% compatible with the original version and Ubuntu continue to maintain the .1 version for people who need that.
The .2 .3 etc. versions include HWE updates that may not be 100% compatible. In order to do both at once Ubuntu commonly modifies the package names.

I think even producing a Y-drive containing updated shared libraries would be tricky.

666philb - Whatever UPUP you decide to do will be fine with me

It would be too much work to produce an updated Fossapup that was 100% compatible with existing savefiles. Users would have to start again with a new savefile and reconfigure their Puppy again

.
Not so sure that would be true.
We have had updated versions of specific Puppy versions, and the old save from the older version, would work in the newer version.
Example:
Tahrpup 6.0
Tahrpup 6.0.3.9
Tahrpup 6.0.5
Tahrpup 6.0.6

Some Puppy versions get updated, during development, and it is recommended, to not try to use a older version save.
Really depends on how much gets changed.

Now about using a Puppy save.

This imppup / indripup 64bit ... alpha is going to need a save specifically for it.
No other Puppy version save is going to work with it.

sorry, but having to make a new save is just part of using Puppy.
There is no way a single save is going to work on any Puppy version.

Plus, I find having to make a new save, is kind of a cleaning out the old junk process.
Save files/folders, can fill up with a lot of stuff, you really never use or do not need.

bigpup wrote: ↑Sat Oct 02, 2021 1:03 pm

Plus, I find having to make a new save, is kind of a cleaning out the old junk process.
Save files/folders, can fill up with a lot of stuff, you really never use or do not need.

It all depends in what proportions laziness and necessity are involved

After changing the platform from Intel to AMD, I had to make a new save. At first I swore. But now the save has become several times smaller, and can do the same thing as the old one.

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:02 pm

zensound: @vovchiks puppyfied binaural beats.

Good program. For some reason (relaxation, peace?) it reminded me of the good old Aura, a Russian program that "simulates" the sounds of the forest (day and night forest). Cuckoos, wind, crickets, fire crackling, rainstorms, various animals, birds, insects and many other sounds of nature.
Here is the English page of the program.
Update. Despite Wine, Fossapup even has a system tray feature for Aura. Tested with Wine 5.4.

issue resolved

A touchscreen behavior is reported on the forum section "Bug Reports"

Hello 666philb
I've tried imppup64 on my Athon 3000G system and my Intel Braswell N3150 system. It seems to work normally, like fossapup64.
I have built a 5.14.10 kernel with the I2C_HID drivers and that seems OK. I'll try changing to the i915 display driver and see if it still causes random freezes on Braswell.

I have removed the zram-swap stuff from rc.sysinit as I did with cagepup. I don't need swap on my systems.

One peculiarity is that the squashfs-tools were built without zstd support although the current packages on Ubuntu have zstd for Focal and Impish.

Thank you for continuing to develop UPUPs.

SNS
Simple Network Setup has recently gotten some new updates. Much improvements.
viewtopic.php?p=2241#p2241
Also some work on the other network connection tools.

May still have more for SNS:
viewtopic.php?p=38773#p38773
.
.

With most people, now installing Puppy Linux to usb drives, as a live install.
Thus, using the boot loader and menu config files, in the ISO.

I wonder, if the boot menu config files, that are provided in the ISO, need to have this change.
In the different menu entries.
Any place there is pmedia=cd
Change it to pmedia=usbflash
Or just have no pmedia=

Installed as frugal on SD card and using a save folder on same.

Menu->Desktop->Redshift
Does nothing.
Did a search for redshiftgui.sh
No files found.
So seems it is not installed.

change it to pmedia=usbflash
Or just have no pmedia=

this script will erase all references to pmedia=cd in an iso file by over writing the characters with space characters.

# removes pmedia=cd from an iso file

f="foss.iso"
cd /tmp/
rm -f blank.sh unblank.sh
echo 'This creates 2 scripts, blank.sh and unblank.sh'
grep -ab pmedia=cd "$f" | grep -v \{ | while read a
do
  b="$(echo "$a" | cut -d: -f1)"
  c="$(echo "$a" | cut -d: -f2-)"
  d="${c%%$"pmedia=cd"*}"
  e="${#d}"
  n="$(echo "$b+$e"|bc)"
  echo 'printf "         " | dd of="'"$f"'" bs=1 count=9 seek='$n' conv=notrunc' >> blank.sh
  echo 'printf "pmedia=cd" | dd of="'"$f"'" bs=1 count=9 seek='$n' conv=notrunc' >> unblank.sh
done
cat -b blank.sh

The way I wrote this script it modifies a file named foss.iso in /tmp/
actually, it does not modify foss.iso directly, it creates scripts in /tmp/ that do the actual work.

I see Frugalpup -flexible Frugal Installer is v20
There is a much newer version 35
viewtopic.php?t=337

Also, DiskPup 35, StickPup 35 and f2StickPup 35

666philb wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:02 pm

pulseaudio: i kind of hate to do it but pulseaudio is required for lots of steam games now and i want people to be able to game with puppy OTB. (don't worry you can still turn it off and have retrovol/alsa)

Hi 666philb. How can I repeat the "correct" start of pulseaudio in Fossapup, so that it is like in indripup?

The general approach is clear. Compile or install from PPM pulseaudio, pavucontrol and pasystray. Make changes to asound.conf. Then run pulseaudio -k (or -D) and pasystray.

But still, what is the sequence of actions? Run as spot or root? What is the best way to start at system boot?

imppup64 9.6.1 frugal save folder

Cpu Frequency Scaling Tool
Not able to change governor
No governors are listed in the selection slot.
The slot is grayed out.

CPU is Intel
Scaling driver intel_pstate
There should be two governors for this driver.
performance
powersave

bigpup wrote: ↑Sun Oct 10, 2021 9:57 pm

I wonder, if the boot menu config files, that are provided in the ISO, need to have this change.
In the different menu entries.
Any place there is pmedia=cd
Change it to pmedia=usbflash
Or just have no pmedia=

I have found that when booting directly from a PUP's ISO file, I am seeing it arrive at desktop regardless if the pmedia is CD/USBFLASH.

Would this impact the PUPSTATE? It does not seem to impact Shutdown-Reboot processing no matter if the boot was pristine or via save-session.

What should I look for that would impact boot or system operations?
Does the pmedia, in its current incarnation within modern PUPs booting from ISO files, change the init process?

Curious on how to help or "test to help" the layout of the LInux line's understanding as we continue forward refinding boot processing. This is one of the 'implied' questions that has been opened in discussing @gyrog's SAVESPEC's performance when certain PC system layouts exist when booting PUP-DOG ISO files to desktop.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.

GTK theme you may want to have in imppup64.

A blue theme with light up effect.
Hover over a select-able item and it lights up with a blue light.

Download.
Unpack into directory
Place this directory in /usr/share/themes

Select the new theme by using GTK theme changer, usually in JWMDesk manager.
.

.
.
Example:

.