install Debian/Devuan as Puppy like

[oui]

This tutor will appear in 3 languages:

(my bad) English: -HERE-
French: viewtopic.php?p=113566#p113566
German: viewtopic.php?p=113563#p113563

Discus please here: viewtopic.php?p=113560#p113560

This thread will be only a step by step TUTOR momentan without some discussion!

STEP 1:

Decide if you want or not build such an own distro! (here an example example: qemu, wine, andbox are present, ISO under 2 GB!)

[oui]

Msg2=Step2: I start my installation

I need

• a partition (using Debian installer; debootstrap installation can begin in a folder) eventually on an USB mass memory
• decide a method: -> Debian installer <- or -> debootstrap <-

Both ways use precompiled binaries to get from the server from one distributor like Debian, Devuan, Ubuntu, Deepin etc. You also need internet connection working well and the rights to use it. A third way would be possible: compile each package yourself (only to remember; I will not continue actually this way).

I mainly use one command, -> apt <- and its principal options (download, install, purge, remove, search) because it is easy to document exactly what you do and you have nothing to do, only look with your text editor and examine the file ~/.bash_history or text files you did get using the -> redirection <-

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>

as this sign and a file name , so in following exemple:

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apt install somewhat > step22installProtocol4somewhat

make possible to get all details written and saved without to have to write more than those "> step22installProtocol4somewhat" (and the name can be short! I did use a long name to explain)...

Exceptionaly, I also can use one of the other classic installations tools of Debian and derivatives alls:

dpkg (the base tool to install), dselect, aptitude, or, really important to solve tricky situations, synaptic. Read the man pages helps!

I will now continue deciding to use -> Debian installer <- and come back (much) later to -> debootstrap <-!

[oui]

Step 3: Way using one Debian installer, installtions begin!

Debian / Devuan offers also really tiny OS images (as Puppy 20..15 years ago!) with only a few more than a Credit-Card-CD! I will use one of those. I did try to use directly the one that google did find for Ceres (the experimental branch of Devuan) but did have at the end no success (perhaps it was too old: the internet is miserable concerning the publications dates...). So I did work using the next one, the ISO for the actual stable version! If you prefer stable, please, don't hesitate and continue after that in stable (although I will myself continue not in testing but in experimental, that is at Devuan "Ceres" and at Debian "SID"). If you prefer google to find the ISO from Debian, or Ubuntu or Deepin if they exist and use then ...

Actually (20240308) the ISO file I did use it following:

https://devuan.bio.lmu.de/devuan/dists/ ... t/mini.iso

I did found it using those following 2 steps of Google search! Please download it and burn it on to an adequate memory (CD or USB stick/card)!

I assume the partition is prepared.

Way using USB stick/card:

I assume you download (after a few seconds in fast internet (only 63 MB)) in the normal ~/Downloads!
Open a terminal and gparted (as root if not in Puppy!)

• Look in gparted the name of your USB stick/card (please NO ERROR, you can erase your HD!!!)
  if sdb (if not sdb in your system adapt well and select the right drive)
  select the 3d option -> new table <- and do it (it will erase!)
  select now -> format <-
  select in format -> FAT16 <-
  select after have done -> set flag <-
  select flag -> boot <-
  The key/card is perfectly ready!

Copy the ISO on to the stick/card:

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dd if=~/Downloads/*iso of=/dev/sdb status=progress

After again a few seconds, if you continue immediately let the stick/card in place and reboot!

you are installing!

[oui]

Step 4: completely standard Debian installation with -> tasksel <-

This installer is the main content of that extreme tiny ISO and will begin soon if the key is in the USB port a boot time (in some PC after having press a special key like F10 or F12 or perhaps other) to boot. Probably you did install so your own actual Puppy...

You install completely normal

and use the (completely legal) propriety that it is permit in -> tasksel <- , being the last selection's sheet the installer will open for you, only one or no option.

I recommend to select only the last option in that menu to get without toil the most tools that you will so or so need later!.

But does not select some desktop environment at all .

After that, the installer will probably install a few more than 120..150 packages (against very more than 1000 for some of the offered desktop environments!).

After that, you are finish: your Debian minimal base is on your mass memory (harddisk / USB drive) and you can restart in the new system. It is as a child and have to learn all.

You

have to decide yourself, what

Note: If you want transmit later your work, enter actually easy -> password -< and -> username <- with own password (I enter the same for both: -> . <-, yes, a simple dot, and username -> x <- or > y < (the key with the little plastic dot on the key or > user <- ! Why? You will see, you want to work fast. But if you wrong some username or password wrong, you risk to work without success .

Note: You can do the same with other Debian installers (from Debian, Devuan, Ubuntu, Mint, Deepin etc.)! But not all versions of the Debian installer offers -> tasksel <- with that configuration and some ones (Ubuntu) offer tasksel with a completely different choice of selections... This is the reason why I did copy the link that I recommend and explain with pictures how to find it as the search machines can have different result in different countries...

[oui]

Step 5: install at first action a bit more!

Certain of you coming from MS-Windows through Puppy Linux into the old first UNIX like Linux system without graphic will probably be frustrated although it is also possible to do a lot without some picture. Unix / Linux did offer a great of adequate applications; but alone to visualize Far East languages, Arabic, etc. did they be problematic! We all have forgotten then.

To continue, have to learn fast the use of a few commands in console

• ls to list the content of the actual directory
• cd a_directory_name to change the directory, for ex.

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  cd /

  or

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  /root/spot

• mkdir to create a new dir, for ex.

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  mkdir /root/my_dir

  or

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  mkdir /root/my_dir/apt_mgs

• apt the genial installation's tool from Debian and all Debian likes,

and

yes, we (perhaps! see the reserve!) begin now the own installation!

for example with:

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apt install info gpm ranger clex mc elinks didiwiki cups samba sc wordgrinder alsaplayer

and you would have a NON GRAPHIC installation able to use mouse (gpm) , document you more (info), show the tree of all your directories and files (ranger, or, alternatives offer with different proprieties, clex or mc). surf in the web ((e)links), smart writer (links in connection with didiwiki: you can write bold, italic, underlined and lot of details like titel, table, etc), print out (cups), connect more (samba), calculate sheets (sc), write text and export then in a lot of formats (wordgrinder), listen music (alsaplayer) a few minutes later!

RESERVE: But, I would not do that now!

I would install differently: only that what I need next!

(I assume you "are in" the right home dir, using ls, where you will receipt your installation's protocols!)

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apt install refractasnapshot-base refractainstaller-base sudo deborphan info xorg sakura ranger > possibly_step5

To conitnue in graphic mode, you have only to invoke

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xinit

(as superuser root!)

or

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startx

(as user)

(or perhaps both)!

You have now ONLY one graphic session (and the usual number of console sessions where you also can log in and interexchange text and actions with the graphic session, for ex. marking texts and porting then using the mouse buffer from the middle mouse key or wheel). The keys CTRL + ALT + F1, F2 etc. are used for the commutation!+

x (the basic graphic environment) and a -> xorg <- would automatic appear. you can try what you want, the poor graphic system will disappoint you, entering "exit", you can live it and go back into the console mode base system (the graphic system is in Linux ALWAYS an on top system, different of MS-Windows, where it is also a base system).

To reboot, you can enter, as superuser,

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reboot

To shutdown and halt

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shutdown -h now

Next depends of a choice of you

Very small an good (JWM) or a bit better (absolute minimal XFCE4 base)?

[oui]

Step 6: The base installation with JWM

To really do more and not to be disappointed, you have to use a a bit longer "apt line" dependent of a choice.

Following line is good if the genial session's manager -> JWM <- is good enough for you:

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apt install refractasnapshot-base refractainstaller-base sudo deborphan info xorg menu jwm sakura > possible_step_6_in_case_of_JWM

After that step, if you do it, and are user and not superuser (Puppy users don't know the difference ) the system will record all your actions in the terminal Sakura or xterm (etc.! You need only ONE terminal! It is possible to remove the other ones excepted if you will use, later, -> slim <- , the minimal graphical login manager (you have now no graphical login manager! It is not recommendable to install it to early because if xorg refuses to work well, xorg is very sensible to kernel changes etc., it is sometimes very difficult to login again. If that happens, try to accede to one of the text mode consoles with CTRL + ALT + F1 or F2 etc. (idem in case of black/blue screen in the graphic session: login as root in the new text session and invoke reboot or shutdown -h now, and you save your file system!). The record of your actions in the terminal is to find in ~/.bash_history !

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cat ~/.bash_history

you can "nurse" (erase lines, repetitions, add with # your_comment in the lines helps for you (or other, but have to take care, that snapshot records this file ). This is a really easy way to take notes to progress in your installation and knowledge of the system, and, important, you can spare work as all lines can reappear using the key CURSOR-UP as you are in nude console! Instead cat, use nano or vi to modify it!

You can immediately install a little more, for example

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apt install refractasnapshot-base refractainstaller-base sudo deborphan info xorg menu jwm sakura l3afpad links2 grun > my_step_6_in_case_of_JWM

Excepted if you did try all above installation's proposals, we continue to be now in pure console mode! Before you enter into the graphic mode, spend a minute to check /etc/jwm/system.jwmrc ! And add a (new) line in it for -> grun <-! Later, you can start each other app (without options, adaptation of right, etc.) without to have to open a new terminal...

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su -
nano /etc/jwm/system.jwmrc
exit

Don't forget exit!

Now, you have experience with that and do the same with /etc/sudoers ! If the system does allow that for nano, try the same operation with l3afpad .

(L3afpad is terrible writing! Change it:

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sudo ln -s /usr/bin/l3afpad /usr/bin/pad

Do that also with the other to long names you use frequently in sudo mode also in terminal! For example, browser (web), refractasnapshot (sshot), pcmanfm-qt (waoh!!! , a real name orgie! Take "fm", it is enough!) , abiword (txt). I egin to really hate all "qts" for this reason... until now, we did use in Linux a simple letter in front of a short name...).

If this is done and all is right, you can begin to optimize step by step your installation: I need soon a graphic (or not ) file manager but did not decide until now witch one il will use! Yes, rox? Or thunar (know by all users of Puppy's with XFCE4? Or pcmanfm (LXDE, LXQT, Extix, etc.)? Or nemo (my prefered one? Or konqueror (yes, it is more than browser!), Etc. It is not easy to decide. It's depend and mark how you work! But the size kann be very different!

Add one of those in front of the list (or at the end) and change the name after the output redirection:

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apt install refractasnapshot-base refractainstaller-base sudo deborphan info xorg menu jwm sakura l3afpad links2 grun rox > step_7_test_rox

but, as apt halts, answer N for (No, do not install now)

and compare

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cat step_7_test_rox

with

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hat step_7_test_pcmanfm

and decide!

I never erase the begin of the line: you see, apt understand itself, the begin is preinstalled... The is that line at the end the mirror of my (about complete) installation
and I can in ~/.bash_history erase the precedent lines and add after the comment sign -> # <- an adequate comment if I did do somewhat important to install more. For example add a private depository to use -> seamonkey <- from the depository of -> mozilla-build <- at -> sourceforge <-.

But, it is not enough!

Read Step 7: avoid to make an heavy usual full installation!

[oui]

Step 7: avoid to make an heavy usual full installation!

To avoid that (beautiful example: Lubuntu!) apt as tools...

And the packages installed before you add those tools will be installed full, but the next one, as the tools begin their effect not!

You can here also to install full divers packages.

You can also test in the output from apt, what would be the difference and it can be, global enormous!

You have different levels to make your installation smart but really enough for your real needs.

• the number of installed app's
• the size of each of the app's
• the choice and concentration of dependence's familys (gtk / qt / kde etc. think about the divers graphic environments, LXQT will his special app's and refuses the other, etc.) - The choice is difficult, it was and stay the base of the mini distro SliTaz not having changed her size like Puppy, see the OLD Handbook of SliTaz from initiator Christophe, was also possible! But the new developer of distros do not know any more inhibitions in this regard! They build towers of webkit/engine one on top of the other in the same distribution
• the languages saved
• the added information per package
• but also how you did use the configuration of apt to reduce the sum of installed stuff!

A simple text file in /etc/apt does that for you (or a collection of such textfiles in a subdirectory, see Lubuntu installations...).

[oui]

Step 8: introduce an apt.conf in /etc/apt !

Only enter (for exemple) this text

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APT::Install-Recommends "false";
APT::Install-Suggests "false";
APT::Get::Fix-Missing "true";
Acquire::Languages "none";
Acquire::Check-Valid-Until "false";

and save it in a new file /etc/apt/apt.conf

Now, you can really install more!

Make snapshots of your work at different stages!

You don't need the maximal stage really if you uses and save the infos contained in your .bash_history! The end line of your apt chain is enough to rebuild it completely !

But yes, you need really an end snapshot to start (in RAM or not) the stage you will preserve against tracking your activities: If you do so, there is nothing important to find to track... If you work at stuff where you need some memory of the steps activity, you start exactly the same installation full installed!

The main importance and difference is to protect against tracking. In some countries, it is today already dangerous to be active at the own PC don't forget it!

[oui]

Step 9: analog to step 6, but with small XFCE4 base only!

This very good page

https://github.com/coonrad/Debian-Xfce4-Minimal-Install

explains in detail what you have to install!

You can both

• spend the place for JWM (and it's recommendation -> menu <-) in you ISO
  or
• erase both in our apt line and use directly XFCE4 with his wonderful -> xfce4-appfinder (I use appfinder also if I install only JWM ; but you have to make an Item in your /etc/jwm/system.jwmrc! as appfinder has itself on top a function analog to -> grun <-, you can erase also grun from the line).

Also you have only to enter in the line the 10 following package name

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libxfce4ui-utils thunar xfce4-appfinder xfce4-panel xfce4-session xfce4-settings xfce4-terminal xfconf xfdesktop4 xfwm

and it is good. People willing to make experiences can try to replace -> thunar <- by rox or pcamanfc if they prefer...

[oui]

Step 10: slim or lightdm and snapshot

if all work well now it will be time to make the first Refracta snapshot before you restart to check what happen.

it is a good idea to install some powerful Debian installation's tool being able to work in console only (synaptic needs the graphical environment). Think about aptitude (if not immediately installed), perhaps, if you know the usage, the forgotten dselect. This because the administration of dependencies is not perfect in Debian: Developers consider sometimes that you install within the official distribution! In those case, -> apt <- claims sometimes that you require a impossible solution but synaptic can often help although apt does it would be impossible.

Now install the display / session / login manager -> slim <- for JWM only

or

lightDM for the XFCE4 environment or both. Note witch packages are installed (if the restart into the graphical environment is not friendly, you can try to remove then using one of the non graphical consoles!

Prefer the option

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apt purge slim

against

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apt remove slim

as also the other files are purged at the same time!

INTERESTING DETAIL: the slim package includes a background picture that you can use in JWM. Adapt in /etc/jwm/system.jwmrc the line selecting the option -> imge <- and entering the full path and name of the background image into the line! You will restart immediately with an attractive desktop without some toil! The adequate new line is:

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<Background type="image">/usr/share/slim/themes/default/background.jpg</Background>

Before you start your first -> refractasnapshot <- using that command and selecting option " 1" after start, use the help of

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sudo apt autoremove
deborphan 

to clean the system (in other situation, old partition, look, look what is in .trash and don't forget to unmount eventually open things...)

To use the -> refractainstaller <- you need a started ISO file of your CD image. And it is better to have already -> gparted <- in the selected app' s that you did already install, as gparted is really more secure and easy as to do all that in command line!

Also make first your first -> refractasnapshot <-. I assume slim or lightdm (as well as xinit) are also installed!

In a session started with a snapshot, you can only work (and save in an adequate partition open with -> mount <-

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sudo mount /dev/sda6 /mnt

To change somewhat in your distro itseff, you MUST install through the refracta installer (on the HD, in an USB memory, in the RAM if you have enough RAM, the installer needs a lot of RAM but at this stage, your distro is small. Perhaps it goes...).

You change into the new installation and make a next snapshot: The changes are in that next snapshot!

[oui]

next Steps?

I usualy install the prensentation MagicPoint = -> mgp <-

hunspell,

all the Gnome Office (Abiword, if I will a text processor), Gnumeric, Grimp, Gimagereader with xsane and tesseract-OCR (Galculator is not useful: Xcal (ist ALWAYS present) do the same, Geditor do not other job as other editors! Xedit also is ALWAYS present, I did already recommend l3afpad, and XFCE4 would prefer mousepad! I use the most time nano...),

and Seamonkey, not firefox (is an idiot app! Did never be adapted to the needs of a suite like Mozillo did become to be!).

I install Seamonkey from the depository Mozilla Build at Sourceforge (if not Ubunut, you MUST use the long key! Read the text at the Mozilla Build wiki!).

You can find the actual files to install Seamonkey using apt here.

Or you can integrate the depository following the instructions in that wiki:

https://sourceforge.net/p/ubuntuzilla/wiki/Main_Page/

Please observe the indication

And the repository signing key ID is 2667CA5C (or 0xB7B9C16F2667CA5C in long format), available on keyserver.ubuntu.com.

and use the long format as you do not come from Ubuntu!

Actually gives Seamonkey me diverses important functions:

• a perfect HTML text processor working totally WYIWYG !
• can working directly with you site online
• an email client
• an address management
• a tree explorer
• an IRC chat client
• an Internet browser
  and
• a front end in graphic mode to look my videos!

NO OTHER

application can offer more functionality!

With above repository (it works really, I am actually in Seamonkey in exact such an installation )

you can add seamonkey in your app's list for apt and install with success.

To look videos, add

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gv mhwaveedit nted libxine2 libxine2-console libxine2-x alsa-utils

(I did copy all the segment of my hidden .bash_history file, that I did use for that installation! -> mhwaveedit <- is clear for Puppyists, -> nted <-, hm, nted, 30 years with Linux culture terror with distros offering, no one, no music sheets editor... Poor families where the children did never see a music editor

-> gv <- is standard viewer for *pdf's !

-> alsa-utils <- , yes, and you can add -> pulseaudio <-. The CLI (command line interpreter) from alsa-utils can also deserve pulseaudio. I would install pulseaudio.

for children, I would also install -> granule <- the learning use application (can manage sound files for foreign languages!)

you can use other (more actual is now mplayer etc. But I prefer the frontends from xine else if I did not install then this time).

as well as ucb-logo (the MAGISTRAL books from Brian Harvey are gratis on the web! But a parent must help the children and
learn itself logo...)

(we have not enough stuff for children and young people in Linux! About never one excepted in emmabuntüs ! A shame...)

My ISO's are rarely bigger than 2 GB else if then include wine, kdenlive, rosegarden, qemu, or andbox!

An you can do in then ALL WHAT YOU CAN DO in a regular Debian installation.

No need of extra devx etc.

My actual ISO (the version I use now and about mirrors that I did explain in detail until now excepted the big ones app's I did name 4 lines before has the size of 853 MB (in Ceres = SID with the XFCE4 version, more comfortable) and need also no devx other that

Try this way!

And enjoy!

• This is the end of my description in English -
  the thread is now free for questions and discussions
  (but I not really: I have to finish the French and German versions and finish other jobs I did not make to write all that!)
  

[oui]

How to upgrade from stable to testing or experimental?

I change only the name of the level in

/etc/apt/sources.list

from -> stable <- (or the concrete name)

into -> testing <- (or the concrete name)

in the first active line (and eventually the second line if you think about to also use sources)

add -> # <- in front of all other lines without this mark, excepted the line for the depository for Seamonkey) as they are no automatic updates in testing or experimental

and do it now:

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apt update 
apt upgrade

and, if I will really experimental (Ceres at Devuan, SID at Debian)

after to have erased the last snapshot being to find in /home/ completely

I make a new snapshot with testing (because difficulties can often appear in experimental and I will have a copy of testing before I change it perhaps heavily)!

(Make always urgently a snapshot if many packages have to be changed!)

I continue and do the same after have overwritten the name for testing into -> ceres <-

and do it now exactly as before (I really make 2 steps, testing, and after that experimental and don't use some other tools / options)!

Don't forget the trick if the start does not success (black window etc.) : CTRL ALT F1 or F2 etc!

2 ways:

• CTRL ALT DEL to reboot

or

-- login and try to return to the step before changing back the names etc. !

I hope you have success as I did have!

After you have your Ceres version,

try to only nurse it all the next years...

But you MUST actualize yourself and not forget that for a long time