Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Hi,

I am new on this forum.
I try to find an installation page but did not find anything.
Nothing on the website...
Finally can be found when searching for "Puppy Linux install" on a search engine...
http://puppylinux.com/install.html
There is no link to this page on the Home page.

No instruction on how should I generate a Live USB with persistence.
I tried to create one with BalenaEtcher on MX Linux but it failed, cannot boot, I got a "Grub" page (it works perfectly with other Linux distribution).
I'm completely lost...

Here is some info: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 2&start=15

also you can search across this forum and the original "old forum" using -> https://rockedge.org/psearch
using the search phrase "how to install Puppy Linux" will give many options of information that may help you

Thank you.
Not very intuitive.
Most people want a Live USB product out-of-the-box and it should be generated in a couple of minutes.
After one day I am still at step 0.
The OS is described as "Ease of use → grandpa-friendly certified ™ " but the installation process is not.

I can give you some easy steps to follow.
First, what type of computer will be booting the USB drive? Do you have ability to burn a CD-ROM with a Puppy Linux. It will make your installation very easy with one. In general let me know about your setup as best as you can and what type of USB drive will you be using?

I've had good success creating bootable USB thumb drives using Unetbootin...there's both a Windows
version and a Linux version.
Wiz

I just tried with unetbootin on MX Linux with a brand new USB key (factory formatted in FAT32):
Black screen with a blinking cursor at boot...

I tried again with Balena on MX Linux with the new USB key (re-formatted in FAT32):
Grub prompt.

Note: With Balena, all files and directories appear with a lock in Thunar and there are less files generated than with unetbootin.

Balena : unetbootin :

For newbies I would recommend RUFUS running in Windows 10, and a download of Bionicpup64 ISO.

RUFUS is easy to use and works well to make a live puppy on USB.

If you run the Bionicpup64 live on one USB, the menu option Stickpup allows you to make a (simple) frugal install on a second USB. But you will need the original ISO file to be accessible, as I recall.

I am not a newbie, I was Unix engineer in the past and installed Puppy successfully some years ago.

But on Linux I cannot generate a USB key.
I will try with Rufus on my old Win7 HD...

pathetic

There must be something that MX Linux is doing to the installs.

Looking at what you posted Unetbootin did.
It looks like all that is needed is on the USB drive.

If this is a UEFI computer.
In the UEFI setup, you may need to disable secure boot and or enable legacy boot or CSM.
Puppy does not come with a Puppy security key needed for UEFI booting with secure boot enabled.
If one of these installers does not provide the security key.
It probably will not boot with secure boot enabled.

Puppy has a installer program that will provided the needed Puppy security key, but it is a program you have to run in a booted Puppy.
Frugalpup Installer is the program.

If still a problem.
When booting.
You do exactly what?
You see exactly what?

you are our eyes.
What exactly is seen happening is always a clue!!!!
Details!!

I use a legacy BIOS.
As I mentionned previously I have either a black screen and a blinking cursor (unetbootin) or a grub prompt (balena).

InvalidUsername wrote: ↑Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:03 am I use a legacy BIOS.
As I mentionned previously I have either a black screen and a blinking cursor (unetbootin) or a grub prompt (balena).

Are you happy to boot puppy and build the usb stick afterwards? Or do you want to boot some other Linux and build the usb stick on that?

Your choice of host system for usb stick preparation will determine which is the best method and we can then offer suitable steps.

The move to UEFI has confused some of the traditional Puppy methods of usb stick creation and there is more than one method.

And with regard to terminology - you probably do not want to "install" puppy. That is a term more applicable to other forms of Linux. Instead you really want to boot puppy from usb. (My comment probably sounds strange but it hinges on the various differences inherent within the puppy structure).

Once we have got you booting puppy from usb then we can talk about setting up persistence. There are various persistence options - but the first step is to find which puppy suits your hardware best - so you may want to be trialling more than one puppy from usb before you even get to the stage of using persistence.

I want to create a live USB as I did dozens of times to evaluate some Linux distros.
Maybe LX Linux is not the best source OS to generate the bootable stick.
It’s the first time I use MX for this purpose.
I will try with win7 and let you know.

I use a legacy BIOS.
As I mentionned previously I have either a black screen and a blinking cursor (unetbootin) or a grub prompt (balena).

Do you ever see a boot menu with different entries for booting Puppy?

No boot menu at all.
Either a black screen with an "_" cursor blinking on the top left corner or a black screen with a grub error and prompt, depending on the stick generation tool being used.

So you are sure your machine does old mbr legacy boot?

If you install from windows you can try LICK.
I used to use Rufus from windows xp. Maybe try an old Rufus for an old computer.

From another linux,
easiest seems to me the dd command if the iso is an isohybrid. e.g. : The result is a 'locked' pendrive (/dev/sdb), not nice, but it is good enough just to try.
(you could do a proper frugal install to another stick running from this)

From Puppylinux you can do a frugal install to a pendrive.
You can install several Puppys each in its own directory.
Frugal install is the preferred install for Puppy, full install is not.
. open the iso
. copy initrd.gz, vmlinuz and all .sfs files to its directory on the pendrive
To install a bootloader and its configfile for legacy boot to the pendrive, run grub4dos.
Before all this, if necessary, use gparted to format the pendrive.

If you already have a working bootloader on the usb, you can just do the frugal install
and add an entry to the existing config of the bootloader, instead of running grub4dos.

It is also possible to do a frugal install on your HDD.
How to use/install a bootloader depends on what is already there.

we have a wika wiki

what is written there

(it's chief is the chief of the Puppy Linux official development!)

important detail for easy installation on usb memory (stick or card):

your chance to have success also depends from format of the memory ! if you can, prefer fat16

then you can probably immediately start with a simple dd transaction:
and reboot

IMPORTANT: sdb1 is only an example! Please check it with the command blkid or in gparted if in already in for ex. some Puppy

see please the 3thd link on this page:

https://bkhome.org/archive/puppylinux/install.htm

or go directly to that page:

https://bkhome.org/archive/puppylinux/flash-puppy.htm

there are the instructions given by Barry Kauler since long years and are now again in his HelpSurfer in EasyPup

@InvalidUsername :-

Puppy needs a somewhat different way of installing, due to its unusual file structure.

The "frugal" install is preferred; most Puppy software is developed/written/packaged to work from this. Sounds crazy if you're used to traditional Unix, I'll admit, but a 'full' install simply robs you of most of Puppy's best features.....because it's not intended to run that way.

Balena Etcher, though a favourite with many, is USELESS for Puppy. Files aren't transferred quite as they should be, and the bootloader is not written correctly. Because it is written with traditional, mainstream distros in mind, it automatically assumes you will be using the abominable GRUB2.....the most miserable, bloated, over-extended excuse for a bootloader it's ever been my displeasure to use. Dreadful thing.

I, too, concur with rockedge. For a very first Puppy, an ISO burnt to CD/DVD is probably the simplest way to go. It boots via syslinux, which is pretty much fool-proof....and once you're up-and-running, every other install option is available to you. The sky is then "officially" the limit!

If you're trying to do this from Windoze, I would recommend a wee app called BurnCDCC, from Terabyte Unlimited. This is available as a self-contained zip file; just download it, unzip it anywhere you want, and run it. It does one thing, and one thing only (but does it very well); it burns an ISO file to an optical disc. That's ALL it does, so you can't go far wrong with it. You can find it here:-

https://www.terabyteunlimited.com/downl ... rncdcc.zip

Hope that may be of some use.


Mike.

I have a machine that required me to hit enter in order to continue from the black screen to the boot menu.

etcher was a no-go for me also, thanks mikewalsh

when having problems making a bootable usb, I always delete and reinstall a msdos partition table before reformatting/partitioning

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:28 am when having problems making a bootable usb, I always delete and reinstall a msdos partition table before reformatting/partitioning

yes! it is also a very good precaution!

- new msdos partition table

- a fat16 partition (depending of the started iso, you can sometimes accede to the rest of memory available on the stick from that Linux installation and use it!)

(The new fat16 partition can not exceed ab. 4 GB!)

oui wrote: ↑Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:18 pm important detail for easy installation on usb memory (stick or card):

your chance to have success also depends from format of the memory ! if you can, prefer fat16

then you can probably immediately start with a simple dd transaction:

Code: Select all

dd if=new.iso of=/dev/sdb1

and reboot

IMPORTANT: sdb1 is only an example! Please check it with the command blkid or in gparted if in already in for ex. some Puppy

The code has to be not
dd if=new.iso of=/dev/sdb1

If you use dd you do not need to format your pendrive.
It will be 'overruled'.
The isohybrid contains the filesystem, including mbr and partition(s).
That is why dd has to write to the drive (/dev/sdb) and not to a partition (/dev/sdb1).

It is different when you do a manual frugal install, i.e. open the iso and copy kernel (vmlinuz), init and main system files (.sfs files).
But even then I would prefer ext3 or ext4 filesystem to copy to.

I would use fat16 or fat32 for a partition to contain data to share with windows
or for a boot/esp partition when you have a EFI machine and cannot do legacy boot.

But:
There are some old machines that do not want to boot from anything else but fat16. Indeed.
(There are also some old machines that do not want vmlinuz, init and .sfs files in its own directory, but only want them in the root of the boot partition. That is also the case for some old Puppy flavours.)

Hi Foxpup

I admit willing I don't know how I recognize an ISO as isohybrid (if I did not read that in the version announcement) exactly as I don't understand why Debian and Ubuntu have a completely different structure within so ISO so that you have less difficulties with Debian ISO's as with Ubuntu ISO's to start then directly from HD through grub2 as well as I have no idea how much grub generations the GNU did create and if all versions react in exactly same manner or if it is depending of how Linuxfromscratch, for ex., did manage the environment (in it's instruction of course, as LFS is not a distribution but only a book of receipts and instructions), and, that comes on the top, if my USB3.0 react exactly like my USB2.0. It is to much special knowledge I will NOT learn . Over that, my "SanDisk cruzer"(*1 have an other structure and I don't know way with which practical consequences. Last detail: I did never use UEFI harddisk, and this matter is not interesting for me and will not become soon interesting for me as my HD 3/4 TB is only half full and regular DOS disk old working is good enough... Over that all, some distros are now warning against the use of unetbootin (I don't know why but it can good work )

Until now I did have last blank CDs (I will not buy new ones!) and did use them and never use some distribution starting only from USB memory as it is the best way to avoid difficulties (PC forum's are full with claim threads about this stuff ; it is a shame for the organizers of the Linux and linuxoid world! My own problem is that a lot of the needing infos are contained in long man pages etc. (where man pages rarely contains examples so that internet sites exist giving examples for the most complex man pages, but again in English) difficult to find in the actual version in other languages as English and my English is poor.

but I did have enormous difficulties to start ISO's from USB exactly using the way years along that you describe!

since I use use the way that I describe in my precedent message, I can start the recalcitrant distributions

I will only one: fast success without have to read tons of documentation!

Now, puppyists really searching a solution: You can try the way given by foxpup and if you have success, all is good

if not, and probably for this reason are you reading that try my way but inspect your memory medium using blkid or/and gparted to find the right short name of your hardware as know by your actual system...

(*1 those 3 old SanDisk cruzer are those I am most using because her old low capacity, only 8 GB, 16 GB and 32 GB.

Hi Foxpup

Yes your info sdb without partitions number is right (I did check in my ~/.history of my full installation)...

The error comes (probably also for other) from the information given by blkid.

Use better lsblk

for ex. with my "SanDisk cruzer" sticks his output:

sdb 8:16 1 7.5G 0 disk
└─sdb1 8:17 1 7.5G 0 part /mnt/sdb1
sr0 11:0 1 1024M 0 rom

I don't know if the second block found and named "sr0" is also usable in dd and what would be the result if different.

(same output but from blkid:

/dev/sdb1: UUID="33E4-2D1D" TYPE="vfat" PARTUUID="f03f0bb3-01"

)

I did forget an other info read at an other place: The flag "boot" seems to have a certain importance! It have to be set...

Finally I tried again with unetbootin on MX Linux...
Now typing this message from Puppy Live USB

I think a big part of the reason why Etcher doesn't work in Puppy is that most mainstream distros are looking for the /media directory; this is where they mount external drives to. Puppy, of course, is more "traditional" in this respect, and mounts external drives to the /dev directory....

Balena Etcher is looking for a directory that doesn't exist in Puppy, so, naturally, it doesn't 'see' any drives, and just reports errors instead.


Mike.

can your installation use the rest of the memory capacity of your USB memory (normally, unetbootin permit that automatically!)?

InvalidUsername wrote: ↑Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:18 pm Finally I tried again with unetbootin on MX Linux...
Now typing this message from Puppy Live USB

live?, or with persistence? fossapup?