KLV-Airedale-alpha Released for Experimentation and Improvement by the Puppy community

[mikewalsh]

Now then, kiddiwinks...

I've put together a modified version of the portable media speed tester, DriveSpeed!, which I created a while back, and which Fred & stemsee further helped modify into more 'complete' versions. Primarily these, instead of being 'portable', were permanently installed, necessitating drive-mount selector mechanisms. All very nice - indeed, this seemed to be what most people wanted / expected - but to my mind, it just added additional complexity to what was always intended to be a fairly simple application.

Eye candy & extra frills'n'frippery are nice, but they add bulk, and it starts getting away from the whole point of keeping stuff small and lean. Anyways; that's enough of my "bitching" ....the interest in the project was appreciated, when all was said & done. And it was, I daresay, good practice for all involved.

----------------------------------------------------

This is a re-worked version of the "earlier" v2.1 - my personal favourite for its simplicity. I've modified the read/write scripts to use the xfce4-terminal instead of rxvt - which isn't available in Void's repos anyway. Instead of block sizes of 256kb, 512kb, and 1Mb, she now uses block-sizes of 512kb, 1Mb, 2Mb and 4Mb. The "test-file" is now "adjustable"; I know @Clarity was asking about the possibility of adding the ability for the user to choose test-files of different sizes, so I thought, what the hell; let's go for it. 'Write' block size, 'read' block size, and test-file size are all now pre-selected via drop-down menus prior to commencement of the tests. Okay, for my new SSD, both read AND write operations are done in a matter of seconds, but I know for a fact that when testing standard HDDs and flash drives or other media, that 1 GB test-file CAN take quite a while to complete! On older, slower hardware, you don't want the operations dragging on for what seems like forever, do you?

Not all of us have ultra-fast drives by any means......but for those of us that DO, a larger test-file can help to give more consistent results. You can choose between 1Gb, 2Gb, or 4Gb.

This employs the original idea I had; you simply keep this somewhere accessible, then when you want to test any drive for read or write speeds you just drag it across to the root of that drive, perform the tests, then delete it when you're finished.

I've attached DriveSpeed! v2.2 'portable' to the bottom of this post. All you need to do is d/l & unzip it, and you can start using it straight away!

Enjoy.

Mike.

[wiak]

- Tas (take a shot) is missing dependency "xrectsel" needed for to select a region.

At least for my own usage, I think I'll likely modify TAS to use scrox instead of xrectsel (since scrox, and therefore scrot, already included for wex use), but since recovering from surgery and still high summer here I doubt I'll be doing much at all for while yet.

[fredx181]

To be honest, if this has so little feedback (as it is lacking e.g. testing, reporting, ideas etc... from members) what's the point then to continue making a future beta or stable ?
Also, although I do have some more ideas for improvement, I'm not feeling very encouraged to put more effort in it if it's development is mostly done by @rockedge & a little help from me only.
Sorry to say the above, but I try to be realistic about what's required for a community release.

Fred

[mikewalsh]

@fredx181 :-

I suspect the fact that it's Void-based may have something to do with it, y'know. For many Puppians, Void is a completely unknown quantity.....and a large percentage of the membership are, shall we say, conservative? A LOT tend to stick with what they know; I confess, you may be right about the interest not being there.....I just didn't want to be the one to mention it.

Me, personally, I simply don't have the skills required to really be able to 'chip-in' and help....and I daresay Erik quite likely fancies a break from it for a bit..? Or, he could have other, more important stuff going on at home ATM. There's no telling.

Mike.

[keniv]

To be honest, if this has so little feedback (as it is lacking e.g. testing, reporting, ideas etc... from members) what's the point then to continue making a future beta or stable ?

Early on in this process (page 3 on this thread) I asked,

Is this pup for experts only? If so am I right in thinking that reports of problems from somebody with my level of experience are not wanted?

I received the following reply from @rockedge

Your input is much appreciated. We need to see all the angles.

I tried to keep up with this but after trying to do things which others were able to get working, which I could not, I eventually gave up. I found this experience very demotivating. I came to the conclusion that someone like myself who is a user of pups, dogs and even EasyOS (having required the help of more knowledgeable members to get some of these working) cannot realistically contribute to a thread like this. I'm afraid it's only for experts as can be seen from the the names of those who make up the majority of contributions to this thread. However, I do not wish my comment to be seen as criticism. I simply want to put a point of view as to why there is a lack of "testing, reporting, ideas etc... from members" as @fredx181 suggests.
I have continued to follow the thread but have not yet had the confidence to try again.
I hope this post is of some help.

Regards,

Ken.

[mikewalsh]

@keniv :-

What were you actually having problems with, Ken? Booting? Installing stuff? Trying some of the 'improvements' that have been suggested by others?

Don't, whatever you do, go getting the idea that I'm any kind of an expert, mate. I'm the "eternal noob", if EVER there was one. If I can fumble my way through stuff, then just about anyone can......

I amaze myself all over again, every time I manage to get summat working!!

Mike.

[rockedge]

No fears.

I will press on, I am testing on several platforms simultaneously all with different specs and much different ages. @fredx181 Please share those ideas with me so I can add them in on some running rigs and see what's what.

I have one machine that unless I install xscreensaver and run it instead of the xfce4-screensaver, the desktop locks up and to get out of it I need to CTRL-ALT-F2 to reach tty2. Login as "root" and killall xfce4-screensaver. Then exit which logs out then CTRL-ALT-F1 back to tty1. WHich allows me to have control of the desktop again. When I run xscreensaver it fixes it. I have tried to disable the compositor, disabled screen lock, disabled screensaver and started picom -b also disabled screen lock in the power manager to no avail.

[bigpup]

Do not go away.
Your help is needed.

Maybe this will help you understand:
Alpha
Alpha software is not thoroughly tested, by the developer, before it is released to customers. Alpha software may contain serious errors, and any resulting instability could cause crashes or data loss.
Alpha software may not contain all of the features, that are planned for the final version.

Basically this is the time to figure out what is actually going to be in it.
If a specific added whatever is going to even work.
Fix the really show stopper stuff.

This is the stages of development in an operating system:
viewtopic.php?t=3683

I could start testing every little detail of a program and report what I find.
But alpha stage of development is not the time for that.
Just seeing if it works, is alpha stage testing.

[rockedge]

I think something like gtkhash needs to be in it still, but mostly the basic "standard" features are now present. Suggestions?
I would like to see @fredx181 's ideas. I believe they will be beneficial.

Otherwise as far as my testing goes, the systems run very stable and like Void Linux, uses very little resources and is very efficient.

[bigpup]

Is there a firewall?
If yes.
How do you control it and set it up?

[rockedge]

All the components are present through the dependencies from NetworkManager like iptables. I am still looking at the best way to set up the firewall. A GUI is needed.

[mikewalsh]

@rockedge :-

Well, I have to agree with you about stability, Erik. It's absolutely rock-solid for me, despite being classified as alpha stage software. I did have one single kernel panic, but a re-boot fixed that; such is not unusual, 'cos I get the odd one on various other members of the kennels at various times.....Puppies of several different generations, and vastly different ages of kernels.

I think it's a fact of life with the Linux kernel, since I've read of this happening to loads of Linux users at different times.....and a re-boot always fixes it, apparently. Given how many millions of lines of code go to make up the kernel, I think it would be a bloody miracle if there never WAS the odd 'glitch' in the system.....

It suspends to RAM without issue, AND recovers 100% perfectly; something that not all Puppies seem able to do without glitching, and momentary freeze-ups after re-starting.

---------------------------------

@bigpup :-

There IS gufw - the graphical 'front-end' for ufw (uncomplicated fire-wall). It's available in the Void repos; I've installed it, but it's not playing ball.....it won't show up. It's a Python3 issue. Go figure..... I always have 'issues' with Python!

Mike.

[keniv]

@keniv :-

What were you actually having problems with, Ken? Booting? Installing stuff? Trying some of the 'improvements' that have been suggested by others?

I started with the alpha3 version. I did not have trouble booting but the rest did give me trouble. I see I posted from page 3 to around page 11 on some very basic problems some of which you helped me with. I the progressed to alpha5 and persisted with this for a while before I gave up. I also had concerns about running without a firewall which I see is still an issue.

@bigpup

Do not go away.
Your help is needed.

At my very low level of of knowledge I have found that I can't provide help. However, my reason for my previous post was to try and give one persons insight as to why there might be "so little feedback (as it is lacking e.g. testing, reporting, ideas etc... from members)" and I hope this counts as help. I will continue to follow the thread.

Regards,

Ken.

[fredx181]

There IS gufw - the graphical 'front-end' for ufw (uncomplicated fire-wall). It's available in the Void repos; I've installed it, but it's not playing ball.....it won't show up. It's a Python3 issue. Go figure..... I always have 'issues' with Python!

I think this problem (again) has to do with 'running as root'.

Solution is to run : gufw-pkexec and the firewall GUI will start. (edit in the gufw .desktop in /usr/share/applications to Exec=gufw-pkexec)
(or: python3 /usr/lib/python3.10/site-packages/gufw/gufw.py works too)

I would like to see @fredx181 's ideas ...

Well not much at the moment, thinking of adding more Thunar Custom Actions e.g. "Pfind Here" "How Big?" "Load SFS / Unload SFS" "Graphical Disk Map" and more...
Been working on xbps package(s) that will create these , will take some time, but I'll come up with something later.
edit: @rockedge I think best through installing .xbps (to be included in the build) or is manually adding these in Thunar OK too ? (which I can help with perhaps)

EDIT: @keniv

I see I posted from page 3 to around page 11 on some very basic problems some of which you helped me with. I the progressed to alpha5 and persisted with this for a while before I gave up. I also had concerns about running without a firewall which I see is still an issue.

The problems you had implementing some changes are things included now in KLV and as you see above, the firewall issue is almost fixed.

[mikewalsh]

@fredx181 :-

There IS gufw - the graphical 'front-end' for ufw (uncomplicated fire-wall). It's available in the Void repos; I've installed it, but it's not playing ball.....it won't show up. It's a Python3 issue. Go figure..... I always have 'issues' with Python!

I think this problem (again) has to do with 'running as root'.

Solution is to run : gufw-pkexec and the firewall GUI will start. (edit in the gufw .desktop in /usr/share/applications to Exec=gufw-pkexec)
(or: python3 /usr/lib/python3.10/site-packages/gufw/gufw.py works too)

Fred, I take my hat off to you, mate. That's fixed it...

I confess, I've seen mention of this "pkexec" thing before, but still don't fully understand what it is, or what it does. Ah, well; can't win 'em all! So long as it does actually function now, that's the main thing.

I've had ufw itself running almost from the day I first installed "Airedale" - from the terminal, it's true, though instructions tell you that once it's started for the first time it will then automatically start at every subsequent boot - but it's nice to have the GUI 'front-end', of course. Especially given that it's available, it's designed to work with ufw, and it IS easy to use.

It was always one of the first things I installed way back during my 'distro-hopping' phase. It's pretty much standard fare across the Linux eco-system.....

Cheers, buddy.

Mike. )

[rockedge]

@fredx181 I have 2 scripts in /usr/local/bin, go_loadmodule and go_unloadmodule that just start Load_SFS to activate or deactivate the sfs. I was cutomizing the menu so both appeared at the top.

Code: Select all

#!/bin/sh
loadmodule -a $1

Code: Select all

#!/bin/sh
loadmodule -d $1

Though it would be very useful to be installed to menu options in Thunar and Rox-Filer

[mikewalsh]

Having said which:-

I confess, I've seen mention of this "pkexec" thing before, but still don't fully understand what it is, or what it does. Ah, well; can't win 'em all! So long as it does actually function now, that's the main thing.

.....here's a fairly comprehensive description of just how powerful 'pkexec' CAN be:-

https://github.blog/2021-06-10-privileg ... -with-bug/

So; now I know..!

Mike.

[fredx181]

Having said which:-

I confess, I've seen mention of this "pkexec" thing before, but still don't fully understand what it is, or what it does. Ah, well; can't win 'em all! So long as it does actually function now, that's the main thing.

.....here's a fairly comprehensive description of just how powerful 'pkexec' CAN be:-

https://github.blog/2021-06-10-privileg ... -with-bug/

So; now I know..!

Mike.

Thanks Mike, probably as much as you hate python, I hate polkit (and pkexec).

[fredx181]

Here's a package that will "install" Thunar custom actions: "How Big?" and "Pfind Here"
(the 'howbig' shell script is included).

pfind-howbig-tca-1.0_0.noarch.xbps

(6.78 KiB) Downloaded 29 times

It's a bit of an experiment TBH, not sure if this is the most convenient way of adding custom actions (rather complicated to make too).
EDIT: How Big? was first introduced in Saluki I believe, later part of Carolina, but I did modify a little.
It can be used with multiple files and/or folders.

How Big?

Screenshot(4).gif (115.84 KiB) Viewed 597 times

[bigpup]

alpha 9.6 clean install and first boot.

I found 211 files in the trash
Maybe forgot to clean it out before making the ISO

Also found tas-1.15_1.noarch.xbps in the /root/Downloads

About a firewall.
A firewall seems to be already auto setup, when the network connection is setup.
I checked it using:
shields up
https://www.grc.com/shieldsup

But a GUI to control settings is needed.

I know you found gufw.
But look at all the added stuff it needs.
Well, it does look and work very well.
.

Screenshot.png (21.38 KiB) Viewed 639 times

.
I wonder if the firewall, that is normally used in all Puppy versions, would work

[rockedge]

@bigpup I did forget to clear the trash! Now I am adding @fredx181's package that adds some features to Thunar that are working well in the test install on a running alpha9.

I'll be building alpha9.7 soon, and will clean out the Trash!

I will have to see how it goes trying to adapt Puppy's firewall. I do like the way gufw is working though so far.

[bigpup]

gufw is probably OK to have installed.
It does look good as a GUI.

Every time I see something wanting python, that (we do not need or want python in Puppy Linux), clicks in the head.

I kept wondering why Thunar did not have delete as a right click option.
Found the option selection to have delete show as action.
Preferences->Behavior->Context Menu

It does put delete next to move to trash.
Seems easy to accidentally click delete, when you wanted to move to trash.
Well, it does give warning: are you sure you want to delete?

[mikewalsh]

@bigpup :-

Python's OK, per se. It's not actually even all that large, but its biggest issue, I find, is that you can't troubleshoot a bunch of scripts.....because with the sole exception of the main Python binary, that's pretty much ALL Python consists of. You can't check it against ldd. Well, you CAN, but you'll get nowhere fast....

Like it or lump it, to a large extent you'll keep running into the need for it, 'cos it's one of the world's most popular scripting languages. 85% of anything you use is going to either use it directly, or else call it indirectly in respect of other functions. Sod's law, I'm afraid..!

If you want a Python-free lightweight Linux OS, you're going to have a pretty bare apps cupboard. That's a fact.

(*shrug*)

Mike.

[rockedge]

@bigpup there is some base python 3.10.1 already onboard and I see that 2 or 3 python modules (lib's) are added to be able to run gufw. I will still probably experiment with the Puppy's firewall system to see how smoothly it could be integrated.

Some form of base python is required in most serious distro's,

[fredx181]

The size of gufw's dependencies is really not much, so I'd vote to keep it.

[rockedge]

@fredx181 @bigpup I agree with holding on to gufw. It does the job well and is straight forward to use. I vote also YES to gufw

[Clarity]

+1

[dimkr]

If you want a Python-free lightweight Linux OS, you're going to have a pretty bare apps cupboard. That's a fact.

+1

In my experience, Perl and Python are almost impossible to avoid. Many packages depend on Python because they contain Python bindings or some Python script, although most of the package contents are usable and useful without Python. But sometimes you need that part of the package. And Perl is impossible to avoid because stuff like intltool and the kernel's build system need it.

You can do some ugly hacks to avoid Perl and Python, but eventually, you'll have to repay this technical debt - for example, when the user tries to install an out-of-tree driver and can't compile it, or a popular application that's half broken because it has an indirect dependency Python.

Most computers from 10 years ago can afford this small increase in size, and nobody needs a distro where many packages are broken because the Python or Perl installation is trimmed and broken.

[rockedge]

Need to address adding CUPS to get some printing capabilities going. I loaded @mikewalsh's Textmaker standalone SFS from the FreeOffice office suite, and wrote a quick letter but had to use Thunar and it's SAMBA connection to a Puppy Linux machine with a Canon MG2500 attached to it, to transfer the document as a PDF to then use CUPS on that machine to print it.

[fredx181]

@fredx181 @bigpup I agree with holding on to gufw. It does the job well and is straight forward to use. I vote also YES to gufw

Just a tip, instead of changing the gufw.desktop in /usr/share/applications, copy it to /root/.local/share/applications and edit to make it Exec=gufw-pkexec
This way it has priority (when logged in as root) and won't be overwritten in case of upgrading gufw.