Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

I did a full install of bionicpup32-8.0-uefi.iso on my old Dell Vostro 1400. With help here I fixed Xlock and added a boot password to keep grands from destroying my old laptop. I even installed a VPN by myself! Now, I'd like to update to bionicpup32-8.0 to latest update (27) without losing all my mods. Help!!

Sad Note:
I learned Fortran over 50 years ago. I also coded Basic, Turbo Basic, Visual Basic, and a little C. I use Ubuntu 20.04 lts on my desktop and wife's laptop with no problems. I've used Puppy Linux off and on since Windows stopped supporting XP. However, I'm still a Puppy Newbie!

Howdy CaptGeorge!

Well, I got some good news and some bad news.
First the bad news. (unless you mis-spoke about having a full install)

Unless you have a particular reason for having that puppy as a Full Install, you should start over and choose a frugal install at first shutdown using a save folder. A save folder puts all changes to the system in a folder that you can easily back up and leaves the puppy system compressed archives in a pristine state every boot. If you break something you can simply replace the save folder with your backup.

Now the good news. You probably don't need to update puppy, it is not like windows. If it runs good just leave it alone.

However, if you absolutely have to run puppy as a full install and absolutely have to have that last update because of some software you need to run, we can help you update it by turning the update delta into a PET file and adding it like that. I do not recommend doing that unless you absolutely have to. But it can be done.

But in all reality I think the best way for you to go ***if you don't absolutely need that full install*** is start over before you install a bunch of stuff and have a whoops. Its not easy fixing a broken full install, its simple to fix a broken frugal install if you have a spare copy of the save folder.

Whats easy about all this is we are here to help and aim you in the right direction.

,.

It's the old saw of folks thinking a "frugal" Puppy is a stripped-back, cut-down version of the real thing. IT IS NOT.

Frugal only refers to the fact that the installation is frugal with storage space; it all runs from highly-compressed files, and the "save" ( file OR folder ) can be run from wherever you specify when you 'install' it.

It's an understandable mistake to make. For many people, they've only ever known one way of installing an operating system, and can't seem to comprehend that there CAN be other ways of doing so. 'Twas never an issue for me; even after nearly 30 years of Windoze I took to the Puppy way of doing things like a duck to water.....I've long been a fan of doing stuff in an unconventional way!

The fact of 'installing' a Puppy (with ALL needed components) to a single uniquely-named directory, and then being able to move that directory from one machine to another, and - with a little bit of judicious editing - be able to 'boot' the contents of that directory, seems to confuse 'em even more.....

(*shrug...*)

perdido wrote: ↑Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:35 am

Whats easy about all this is we are here to help and aim you in the right direction.

Absolutely, mate. Couldn't have put it better myself.

Mike.

Only to add to what's been posted already. A frugal Puppy is a modular build consisting of the following files:
initrd.(?z) -- which creates a RAM disk on bootup with instructions for managing the other files;
vmlinuz -- the kernel -- sort of like the engine to run other components
zdrv_xxx.sfs -- always contains the drivers compiled against the kernel which are one part of a 2-part system for communicating with a computer's hardware, i.e. monitor, mouse, keyboard, sound-card. May include firmware.
fdrv_xxx.sfs -- firmware, the second part of that system, but not kernel-specific so can be used with any kernel and is sometimes packaged/downloadable separately. [But, of course, included in an ISO].
Puppy_version_number.sfs -- the core applications (file-manager & window-manager), infra-structure, basic user applications and such goodies a Puppy's dev decides to include. It's contents are what distinguishes one Puppy from another.

Because of its modular build, it is possible --not often really necessary*-- to up-grade a Puppy's kernel (and zdrv) in order to obtain the latest security patches or to work with a new computer's hardware. It is also possible to 'down-grade' a Puppy's kernel & zdrv in order to work with an old computer's hardware. With Puppys published within the last 6 years +/- such 'kernel swap' can done manually in about 5 minutes. There's also an application which can shave a couple minutes of that procedure.

About the only applications which require updating are web-browsers, and this because web-browsers creators (e.g. mozille.org, google) frequently update to provide greater security and enhanced capabilities, and websites are increasingly denying access to other than recently published web-browsers. Despite such trend, Seamonkey 2.46 published about 5 years ago, can still provide satisfactory performance.

On this Section of forum, viewforum.php?f=90 you'll find various Web-browsers available for Puppys. Among them are 'portables' published by Mike Walsh and fredx181. Portables are just that: because they are not installed you can even use them with 'Full installed' Puppies.

-=-=-=-=-=--
* There are various reasons why a frugal-puppy is, OOTB, inherently safe; not the least of which is that (except for the things you install and preserve) it's core systems are in read-only files on storage. There have been no reports by any Puppy user of malware infestation. But, if you choose to, you can take additional steps to run an 'almost invulnerable Puppy', viewtopic.php?p=2235#p2235; or 'harden' web-browsers, viewtopic.php?f=90&t=1491

Thanks, peridido and mike.

I installed a full puppy because I knew it worked well on "old hardware". And, after all a Dell Vostro 1400 is OLD hardware.
I'll try to re-do my mods and go for frugal install. If it slows down much I can always go back to a full install.

BTW....

mikewalsh wrote: ↑Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:05 pm

It's the old saw of folks thinking ....

I AM that old folks. LOL My first install of Puppy was on my first business laptop - a Dell CPx - designed for Windows 98. It's been long since retired, but still runs Puppy! My Dell Vostro 1400 was my second business laptop. Unfortunately, I had to run Windows because of the specialized engineering software required. It lasted until I retired and I gave it to my wife loaded with Ubuntu. It worked pretty well until Ubuntu 16.04lts when it became "waaay toooo slooow". Now she has a newer laptop running Ubuntu 20.04lts and is happy again!!

Thanks again.

There is very little performance reduction in running a 64-bit operating system rather than a 32-bit; maybe none. [Nothing significant with respect to the system, itself; but running multiple 64-bit applications (each slightly more demanding than their 32-bit counter-parts) may take a tole.
The real determining factor regarding how well your system performs is the amount of RAM it has. The Vostro 1400 can use a maximum of 4 Gbs: (2 Gbs modules in each of its 2 slots). See https://www.memorystock.com/memory/DellVostro1400.html for information about the cost of any appropriate upgrade.

I doubt that it will make much difference, but the applications built into both a Xenialpup or a Xenialpup64. http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/puppy-xenial/ are (slightly?) less demanding than those in Bionicpups; and the 'xenials' can still run current web-browsers.

Thanks perdido, mike and mike! Well I've got puppy frugal working I think. I originally partitioned my HD for Puppy full install. And I think I've installed Puppy Frugal there.

I only have 2GB of ram but everything appears to be working just fine so far.

mikeslr wrote: ↑Sun Jun 20, 2021 5:10 pm

... websites are increasingly denying access to other than recently published web-browsers.

If one is happy with the installed browser then spoofing the UserAgent for the offending site(s) is the way to go.

spoofing works for me on many occasions. I have some network cameras that had firmware updates occur and suddenly a browser from Linux can't access the controls...needs Windows and a plugin once IE or Edge is detected. Otherwise one gets a message saying no and go get Windows. In this case spoofing works very well and I can use Firefox in a Puppy to access the camera configurations