Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Google Will Track Your Location ‘Every 15 Minutes’—‘Even With GPS Disabled’
“You can’t say no to Google’s surveillance,” the Cybernews research team warns, describing a secretive stream of data they say continually transmits from a new phone to Google’s servers. Even more “concerning,” they say, “the phone periodically attempts to download and run new code, potentially opening up security risks.”
https://www.forbes.com/sites/zakdoffman ... -pro-fold/

I knew this years ago, but apparently it was not mainstream news before now.

All mobile phones have an 'Emergency Calls' setting which allows the user to make phone calls.

So, it goes without saying that this service requires the use of location services in order that the authorities can locate you in the event that you are unable to determine/inform them where you are.

This service will work regardless of 'Location' services being disabled.

1) we should do what we can do, what we have power on, to minimize the (risk of) harm. eg. a good start could be the adoption of a more secure and private OS such as https://grapheneos.org/

2) hypocrisy of forbes.com to make an article about a company tracking users and then they:

below the link to an online scanner tool that scan websites for tracking elements. I just scanned forbes.com

https://themarkup.org/blacklight?url=ht ... orce=true

darksun wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 4:24 pm

1) we should do what we can do, what we have power on, to minimize the (risk of) harm. eg. a good start could be the adoption of a more secure and private OS such as https://grapheneos.org/

2) hypocrisy of forbes.com to make an article about a company tracking users and then they:

below the link to an online scanner tool that scan websites for tracking elements. I just scanned forbes.com

https://themarkup.org/blacklight?url=ht ... orce=true

Hypocrisy flourishes on-line. Most websites that espouse the evil of Google's behavior are using Google services.

Jasper wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 3:02 pm

All mobile phones have an 'Emergency Calls' setting which allows the user to make phone calls.

So, it goes without saying that this service requires the use of location services in order that the authorities can locate you in the event that you are unable to determine/inform them where you are.

This service will work regardless of 'Location' services being disabled.

Yes, but isn't it possible for the location services to work without google "knowing" about it, ie. pass through with no retention by google?

in this case it is rather

below url of a private online pictures/gallery sharing website, I've uploaded backlight results as of today

https://lutim.ggc-project.de/gallery#OC ... jiEzCE.png

darksun wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 5:24 pm

in this case it is rather

below url of a private online pictures/gallery sharing website, I've uploaded backlight results as of today

https://lutim.ggc-project.de/gallery#OC ... jiEzCE.png

There seems to be a complete breakdown of ethics. Everyone and their uncle has a hand in the cookie jar.

Media websites are all like this: lots of trackers, some benign, heaps of SEO shenanigans.

https://detailed.com/google-control/ is a little example that prompted me to make some uBlacklist filters (here), but it isn't really related to wha you're pointing out @Governor.

As for phones, you can use ADB on Android to disable the GPS functionality, but it ends up breaking other apps.

Governor wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 5:18 pm

Jasper wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 3:02 pm

All mobile phones have an 'Emergency Calls' setting which allows the user to make phone calls.

So, it goes without saying that this service requires the use of location services in order that the authorities can locate you in the event that you are unable to determine/inform them where you are.

This service will work regardless of 'Location' services being disabled.

Yes, but isn't it possible for the location services to work without google "knowing" about it, ie. pass through with no retention by google?

It's not possible to use a gps dongle with google maps or google earth, at least it's not easy.

https://forum.puppylinux.com/viewtopic. ... ps#p113334

AS @Jasper has helped, I agree. Google or Facebook or "X" is not the problem. ... never has been.

This 'tracking" as you point to has been a staple since SDLC, 'Ethernet' and the web has been created and available publicly. When the 'web' was created, in conjunction with YOUR phone company(s), this has been a staple.

You, or I or anyone may find fault, but its too late as this has a 4 decade head start. So your blaming one company or another is not an approach that singling someone out, means that your someone is responsible. They are not.

Sorry if this is bad news to anyone, but its not new news.

Why not...?

https://e.foundation/e-os/

/e/OS is a complete, fully “deGoogled”, mobile ecosystem

/e/OS is an open-source mobile operating system paired with carefully selected applications. They form a privacy-enabled internal system for your smartphone. And it’s not just claims: open-source means auditable privacy. /e/OS has received academic recognition from researchers at the University of Edinburgh and Trinity College of Dublin.

We could have just focused on an OS, but apps and online services are crucial components of our everyday experience, too.

These online services, including our search engine, email platform, cloud storage and other online tools, create a unique privacy enhanced

A "deGoogled" OS

/e/OS is a “deGoogled” version of Android OS. It has an open-source Android OS core, with no Google apps or Google services accessing your personal data.

Google default search engine has been removed from the OS everywhere and replaced with our meta-search engine
Google Services have been replaced by microG
Connectivity checks do not use Google servers
We do not use Google’s Network Time Protocol servers
We do not use Google’s Domain Name System servers
Geo-location uses Mozilla Location Services in addition to GPS.

It is possible you are worried about loosing all your android apps, your location, your access, your.... /e/OS is compatible with all your favorite Android apps, because keeping your data private shouldn’t mean forgoing your digital resources.

Of course, you can continue using google, but it is your decission, not your obligation

Have a nice day u all.-

CHEERS- PP4MNK

pp4mnklinux wrote: Fri Oct 11, 2024 6:43 am

Why not...?

https://e.foundation/e-os/

8<----------

It is possible you are worried about loosing all your android apps, your location, your access, your.... /e/OS is compatible with all your favorite Android apps, because keeping your data private shouldn’t mean forgoing your digital resources.

Of course, you can continue using google, but it is your decision, not your obligation

Have a nice day u all.-

CHEERS- PP4MNK

This looks really good. Can anyone comment on how the two compare?
https://e.foundation/e-os/ VS https://grapheneos.org/

dancytron wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 11:09 pm

Governor wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 5:18 pm

Jasper wrote: Thu Oct 10, 2024 3:02 pm

All mobile phones have an 'Emergency Calls' setting which allows the user to make phone calls.

So, it goes without saying that this service requires the use of location services in order that the authorities can locate you in the event that you are unable to determine/inform them where you are.

This service will work regardless of 'Location' services being disabled.

Yes, but isn't it possible for the location services to work without google "knowing" about it, ie. pass through with no retention by google?

It's not possible to use a gps dongle with google maps or google earth, at least it's not easy.

https://forum.puppylinux.com/viewtopic. ... ps#p113334

I do not own a S.M.A.R.T. phone. I have a 2G phone without e-mail, internet, WiFi, Bluetooth or GPS. I use it for voice calls and SMS. I use my computer to go on-line. I hate small screens and non-existant (virtual) keyboards that are way too small for my fingers, and would reduce typing to using one finger typing one character at a time.
My wife has a Samsung (without a removable battery), and it is completely compromised with Google everything. I am just trying to figure out how to de-Google it without turning it into a brick.

Governor wrote: Fri Oct 11, 2024 9:33 am

This looks really good. Can anyone comment on how the two compare?
https://e.foundation/e-os/ VS https://grapheneos.org/

GrapheneOS is recommended, it is regarded as the most private and secure OS out there for mobiles and as well as more than most Desktop OS too.
It is out of scope to detail the reasons in here.
There is plenty of public information on internet if someone wants to go deep into this.

Absolutely Graphene.

/e/ uses microG, no telemetry sent to Google, modified NTP and DNS servers, modified GPS service. Uses the "App Lounge" which combines the Aurora Store with F-Droid and PWAs. Has a tracker blocker. Requires you to have an @murena.io account for some functionalities.

Graphene is Pixel-only (plus a few others maybe) but is the most "hardened" of the alternative ROMs.

The GrapheneOS experience might scare some away. Some apps may not work without.

Others to check out are iodéOS, Calyx, Divest and Replicant.

Something is odd going on in this thread.

Its attempting to raise a FEAR among us as I am trying to understand its direction.

I look over the thread indicating google ... google ... google ... google ???

I am NOT standing up for Google or any Corporate entity. I have been around business majors running corporations which have products they sell to others. Any corporate, and I do mean ANY corporate as defined by Capitalism is inherently designed to both survive and grow. Where that be Apple, Samsung, ATT, Rogers, Tesla, Shell, etc they ALL will take every step possible to survive and grow.

Now, the author says he does NOT subscribe to having modern technology. That is a choice ALL of us have. But to attack a technology because they do not like something they dont have is a bit disingenuous to say the least. Much like a college student attacking another student because they dont have a Windows laptop. (yes, I just saw that).

So can we look at this a little differently with a bit more info on this thread.

• Is it the OS that is bad as if does/does not afford some thing of genuine value? Yes the OS exist, but is it doing something that any corporation would/does not do?

• Is it the apps on the OS that is bad because it poses a danger that we dont understand or can be shown to be taking steps that are questionable?

• Is it the storage technology that is bad as it poses some real danger to misguided instructions that are not in the user directed interest?

• Is there something wrong with the encryptions that are used within the many different protocols that is employed by ALL technologies?

• OR IS THIS THREAD, which didn't start off with this question;

  Is there any members who are using alternate technologies that they have found favor in achieving user needs on what is considered to be a SMART device because I, the author, am interested or considering in getting one?

What is this thread leaning or guiding toward? (Please forgive me for being so stupid to miss its point)

Clarity wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 5:38 am

Something is odd going on in this thread.

8<----

What is this thread leaning or guiding toward? (Please forgive me for being so stupid to miss its point)

You lost me completely. I have no idea what your meaning is.

@Governor

The UK is turning off 2 +3 G services in the next decade as reported by the Regulator OFCOM:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-bro ... providers/

However, individual telecommunications operators can bring this forward as the roll on 4 +5 G services:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-bro ... witch-off/

Jasper wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 8:30 am

@Governor

The UK is turning off 2 +3 G services in the next decade as reported by the Regulator OFCOM:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-bro ... providers/

However, individual telecommunications operators can bring this forward as the roll on 4 +5 G services:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-and-bro ... witch-off/

OFCOM-3G.png

This is not unexpected, but still a little alarming. At some point, I will likely be forced into getting a non-Google/non-Apple S.M.A.R.T. phone with a removable battery and keep it stored in a Faraday box when not in use.

@Governor

Our 'Royal Mint' is turning our electronic waste (yes that includes telephone handsets!!) into gold.

Well, it shores up our bullion reserves

https://www.royalmint.com/aboutus/press ... into-gold/

Clarity wrote: Fri Oct 11, 2024 12:10 am

AS @Jasper has helped, I agree. Google or Facebook or "X" is not the problem. ... never has been.

This 'tracking" as you point to has been a staple since SDLC, 'Ethernet' and the web has been created and available publicly. When the 'web' was created, in conjunction with YOUR phone company(s), this has been a staple.

You, or I or anyone may find fault, but its too late as this has a 4 decade head start. So your blaming one company or another is not an approach that singling someone out, means that your someone is responsible. They are not.

Sorry if this is bad news to anyone, but its not new news.

You are not making sense (not to me, anyway). Burglary has been going on since there were humans, but if there is a big increase in this activity in my neighborhood, that is news I most definitely want to hear about. It is never too late to desire self-preservation, privacy and prevent unauthorized intrusions into one's life.

Governor wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 7:56 am

You lost me completely. I have no idea what your meaning is.

Yes, that is the problem. "I am asking, exactly, that to you."

For example: If you ONLY want a phone, ANY phone, to just make calls, why are you attributing this thread to Google or 5G or ???

Any phone, even a smart phone, can be used to ONLY make calls on 3G/4G/5G.

This continues to be the world we live. So, I'm back to my questions in the earlier post as I search for the meaning or the objective.

I guess, I'll just be moving on...

@Jasper :-

So, you're telling me that sectors like the utility companies are going to be forced into upgrading over 40 million domestic & business smart meters.....just because some toothless regulatory body says they MUST?

You know who will have to foot the bill, don't you? You and me, mate......and we'll have no say in the matter, because "society" now sees internet access as a basic human right.....all the while doing absolutely nothing to stop the insane human breeding that is pushing the global population ever closer to 10 billion +.

I can honestly say I'm glad I won't be around in another 30 years time. Yet I'm curious about this; those links from Ofcom say that EE have completed switching off their 3G networks.....so how come my 3G phone is still functioning on EE's network?

Mike.

Clarity wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 6:34 pm

Any phone, even a smart phone, can be used to ONLY make calls on 3G/4G/5G.

do you have any evidence that when used with the intent of only making a call, extra information is not transmitted?

@williwaw

Google "hardened cell phones" and choose one that matches YOUR personal need.

Enjoy

do you have any evidence that when used with the intent of only making a call, extra information is not transmitted?

Yes. This is explained in detail by Edward Snowden. Where he exposed the NSA's looking at everything on a global scale, one can be rest assured, that call data is collected for "anti-money laundering", "anti-narcotics trafficking" and any perceived "potential terrorist acts" most likely the domestic surveillance is done by tapping into cell transmission and VOIP service providers phone call data. The police use it a lot. The providers already keep track down to the millisecond who one calls...that's how they know what to charge in money.

rockedge wrote: Sun Oct 13, 2024 4:58 pm

Yes. This is explained in detail by Edward Snowden.

In 2007 there was an investigation of ATT, the largest carrier in America concerning room 641A long before the Snowden revelations.

As of 2018 it was reported AT&T currently boasts 19,500 “points of presence” in 149 countries where internet traffic is exchanged.

I was hoping @Clarity had more recent info to prove things may have changed. Asking Google for suggestions how to to avoid surreptitious collection of information seems a bit counter intutitive.

rockedge wrote: Sun Oct 13, 2024 4:58 pm

most likely the domestic surveillance is done by tapping into cell transmission and VOIP service providers phone call data

"They" don't tap into cell transmissions, "they" are the first link in the chain.

Again, I raised my questions not to expose conspiracy as often the sources are usually click-baits which seem to be the reason this thread was opened and I wanted to be certain.

Both @Jasper and @rockedge are trying to steer the thread toward product solution/knowledge to help others viewing who are seeking cell solutions that provide needed services that most users need.

I offer this: WE, as product users, have little to no control over what manufacturers give us. What we do have control over is to choose a product that makes sense for the needs we have. I agree with this philosophy.

Lastly, I offer, that ALL of the authourities/countries of the world are listening. Even if WE developed our own, they will soon be listening to that.

There are 2 elements that WE are on-guard, as best we can, is to choose technology-product that affords the data (communications in today world is moved over phone services as 'data') protection(s) we desire.

So, CHOOSE what works best if you are seeking a product solution. If not, then we are engaging in click-bait that doesn't/wont lead to knowledge for a product or a technology.

Its the view I subscribe to and I realize others will choose their own views.