Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

I've used puppy in the past before uefi. It always installed fine.
Now I have a newer laptop which I presume has uefi.

It was said in a thread here to do the boot install from frugal pup installer. It doesn't seem to do anything,as windows just boots as usual. But the installer in puppy said it did something.

I can't use windows anymore as it's gone ridiculously slow with browsing.
I'd like to install puppy to the hard drive and keep the files In sda5 ,my personal stuff. So I can't follow the install guide on this forum as it wipes the whole drive.
I don't mind if windows itself is gone.
I'm using a recent fossapup DVD which I can boot to,but it doesn't load the puosave. So I lose everything when I shut down puppy linux

@Wall_axe :- Hallo.....and to the "kennels".

First things first. It will help us to help you IF you can let us have machine specs when posting for help/assistance; desktop? laptop? make. model, CPU, amount of RAM, type of graphics - onboard? discrete?.....that kinda thing. So; if you could do that one simple thing for us, it'll make it easier to help you...

Please remember; we're not psychic, and we don't have a crystal ball. We need SOMETHING to work with, y'know? We can't read your mind and divine what the problem is, because we're not there in the room with you, looking over your shoulder..!

Then we'll see if we can help. Over to you.....

(Incidentally, you won't get a boot menu, unless you install it yourself, from Puppy. Windows won't go out of its way to help, because as far as Windoze is concerned, it doesn't even "see" Linux. And I'll bet a pound to a penny that you burnt the DVD 'closed', instead of leaving it 'open'......which allows the writing of additional data back to the disc itself.)

Mike.

I don't mind if windows itself is gone.

if windows was is gone, one would normally repartition the disk. you can do this from your dvd

installaling alongside windows would be a different scenario involving first to see if something in windows is preventing your puppy from booting

I'm using a recent fossapup DVD which I can boot to,but it doesn't load the puosave.

before you decide, you could also put puppy on a usb, have a savefile/folder, learn the process of partitioning and installing to disk better and still have windows on the hd

The laptop has an i3 processor,16gb of ram.Onboard graphics.

I might try using USB.

But just in case I can't get that to work what should I try next?

My personal files are in the windows partition.

Would repartitioning wipe the drive of files?
If I did repartition , what partitions should I create.
The guide in this forum seems to have the user wipe the drive.

I got netbootin to 'work' because it gives an option to boot into windows 10 or netbootin.
But if I choose netbootin it doesn't actually work then. So it is possible to install things to this laptop.

Is there a way of booting from DVD and loading the pupsave from the hard drive?

Wall_axe wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2024 6:52 am

My personal files are in the windows partition.

this limits you to a savefile rather than a save folder. you need an ext partition for a save folder but it is more convient to use.

Would repartitioning wipe the drive of files?

yes, you would need to copy your files to the usb before repartitioning the windows hd, and copy them back

If I did repartition , what partitions should I create.

viewtopic.php?t=5275 is a good place to start, there are many different ways to partition depending on your needs

I got netbootin to 'work' because it gives an option to boot into windows 10 or netbootin.
But if I choose netbootin it doesn't actually work then. So it is possible to install things to this laptop.

if you wish to keep windows, then there is a way to use unetbootin-just have to troubleshoot why it doesnt work

Is there a way of booting from DVD and loading the pupsave from the hard drive?

I dunno, how did you boot when you created the savefile on the hd?
again, I would consider a USB for expermintation, use and storage. Repartition the hd when you are sure you want to delete windows

Ok thanks for the advice I miss the old days where having windows and puppy together was possible within ten minutes.

I booted from the DVD when I created the save file

Wall_axe wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2024 1:10 pm

I booted from the DVD when I created the save file

which puppy? what machine specs?

I miss the old days where having windows and puppy together

have you had a savefile working with a dvd boot on this machine before?

You may want to keep Windows in order to run Tax Programs or some others for which Linux does not have acceptable alternatives. If not, you can format the hard-drive with gparted selecting the GPT scheme rather than ms-dos. GPT supports many partitions, while the ms-dos scheme will only support 4 primary partitions. [A primary partition can be configured as an Extended Partition which can then be divided into several logical partitions. But when I did that my computer frequently 'lost' those with everything on them. Some techy on the old Forum whose opinion I valued suggested that the Extended-Logical mechanism really was just 'experimental'. Which would explain why the GPT scheme was developed].

If you format using the GPT scheme williwaw's advice must be followed. But if your can live with one or two Linux formatted partitions, see this post, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 02#p107302

With Windows being your current and only operating system, I recommend always starting your exploration of Puppy by deploying one to a USB-Key using Rufus. See this post and those which follow on that thread for specific advice as to which version of Rufus to use and how to use it. https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 522#p40522.

After using Windows tools to create 'Unallocated' space on the hard-drive, the Puppy deployed to a USB-Key using rufus will include the tools you need: gparted to format the Unallocated space as Linux; and Menu>Setup>Frugalpup Installers to create a boot-loader that will dual-boot your Puppy and Windows.

Personally --as I often setup a 'new-to-me' computer to boot several Puppys-- I install grub2config, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 703#p29703 into my 'USB-Puppy' and use it to create the boot-loader. It will create boot-listings for Windows and all the Puppys I've manually located on the hard-drive. See this thread for details, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 1788#p1788

p.s. Having created a Linux formatted partition, it's a simple matter to copy your data files from the Windows partition onto it; then again use gparted to reformat the Windows drive to Linux. In this scenario, the only thing which would remain of your current setup is the small partition where Windows located its boot-loader system and where you've already installed FrugalPup or grub2config's grub2 boot-manager.

Ok didn't know I could use windows to shrink it's usage of the drive thanks.
I'll try your suggestions

Before you make all these changes to your hard disk drive, pick out the files you don't want to lose and copy them to another drive such as a USB thumb drive.

Hello @Wall_axe

@mikeslr instructions are detailed and work well. After you have done this two or three times you will easily install Puppy to any drive without referring to Mike's notes. It's blindingly easy to use. Trust me! I used his method to install various versions of Puppy (including multiple variants on the same drive) many times.

Flash's advice to back-up is also wise.

If you install Puppy to a flash drive you can boot, experiment, format two or three other drives and shut-down without touching your hard drive. In other words your Windows environment will be untouched. If you save a text file (or word-processor file to the Windows drive (from Puppy) the file will be there when you boot either Windows or Puppy.

If you quit your Puppy Linux session without making a "Pupsave" file you will lose the (Puppy) configuration setup you made (when you first ran Puppy) - but your pristine installation will remain 'like-new'. If you make a "Pupsave" file when you shut down the first time your initial config work will appear next time you boot. Enough said.

If @bigpup were here he would advise - DO NOT HIBERNATE Windows. Shut it down completely. Search this forum and you'll see that stated many times.

I've been using Puppy since 2017. Love it.

собака

When I shutdown puppy that was ran on the USB drive it says no need to save the SFS file cos it's a proper installation.

I reboot the os,on the USB drive.

It says it couldn't load the SFS file because of read write privileges.

Wall_axe wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2024 10:52 pm

When I shutdown puppy that was ran on the USB drive it says no need to save the SFS file cos it's a proper installation.

I reboot the os,on the USB drive.

It says it couldn't load the SFS file because of read write privileges.

it's bit hard to follow what you are wanting to do or what you have already done without you being a more explicit.

it says no need to save the SFS file cos it's a proper installation.

It says it couldn't load

what app is telling you that? can you post the error without paraphrasing?

I see you made a usb.
how did you do that?
when you hover your mouse over the usb icon in the lower left, what filesystem is reported?

The file system is iso9660

I first burned fossapup to DVD, it saved a SFS file to the hard drive.

Upon booting again it wouldn't load the SFS. So it was like a fresh installation, unfortunately.

Then I made a USB drive with Rufus On windows.
I used a fossapup iso image.

When shutting that down puppy said:
Mounted directly on top layer,no need to save.

When booting from USB it says it can't read the SFS file left there by the DVD version due to permissions.

Then it boots as a fresh installation

if the filesystem on your usb is iso9660 then there are better ways to create your usb and have persistence.
Instead of using rufus to set up your usb, boot into your "live" DVD, and use frugalpup to create a frugal install on your usb using this tutorial
viewtopic.php?t=5275

installing to a usb as if it was an internal HD will give you more options going foreward

Ok I setup a fat32 partition as it said but after pressing boot on frugalpup it only shows the hard drive (sda) as a possible location to write the boot menu not the thumb drive (sdb)

i presume you are following the tutorial that uses gparted and frugalpup?
take it from the top and delete so you can start from scratch

heres another basic tutorial with a bit more explanation
https://www.linuxconsultant.org/beginne ... h-gparted/

about the ony way you can screw up is to choose the wrong disk, so make sure you are operating on the USB before commiting any changes,

as per the tutorial specific to puppy, you will need 2 partitions to use frugalpup
fat32
ext3
both will be primary type with no need to use the dropdown on the primary button

https://gparted.org/index.php

I'm trying again but just wondered,
If I'm formatting the entire drive and devoting it to puppy why does the tutorial make me install it as frugal?

The full install would be a lot better for large apps etc.

See this post, https://oldforum.puppylinux.com/viewtop ... 9#p1023489

A Full Install would not be better for large Apps. Large Apps are most often packaged as SFSes --which a Full Install can't use-- requiring NO RAM when unloaded or AppImages or portables. See Mikewalsh's complete list of portables, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 734#p48734. Portables are designed to locate configuration files, cache and work files in their own folder rather than in the User's Home folder. Under Puppys, that Home folder is /root and /root always occupies --and uses RAM. Although AppImages will locate such files in a folder in /root, with a Frugal Install, that folder can be moved out of /root --to your Home partition-- and symlinked back. The AppImage follows the symlink and is fully functional. But little RAM is used. In effect, like a Full Install, the entire Partition is used.

Even when a large application has to be installed you have two choices. You can add the 'nocopy' argument to the boot Stanza. When that argument is used, none of the contents of Fossapup's applications --those builtin and those you've added by Remaster-- are copied into RAM. On bootup they are only indexed in RAM, with the index followed to copy into RAM just those files then needed (which are dropped when not). The nocopy argument transforms a Frugal install into the equivalent of a Full --except for the small initrd, vmlinux and the 'alphabet' file-systems, fdrv.sfs, adrv.sfs, and ydrv.sfs. These are compressed files copied into RAM cache as such, indexed and again only copied from RAM cache to 'Active RAM' as needed; dropped when not.

[For an explanation about 'nocopy' by someone who actually knows what he's doing,dimkr, see https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 68#p108568].

If you don't include the 'nocopy' argument that's also how Fossapup's builtin (and remastered) applications are handled. Puppys are very efficient in managing RAM/RAM-cache. A file-system in RAM cache only reduces the amount of RAM available for use by about 1/5 its size uncompressed. See, viewtopic.php?p=4070#p4070.

The contents of your SaveFile/Folder are not copied into RAM on boot-up. They are only indexed and pulled into RAM as needed, dropped when not. Consequently, when the 'nocopy' argument is used you have almost the equivalent of a 'Full' install, with the benefits of a Frugal and have avoided the detriments of a Full.

Wall_axe wrote: ↑Fri Jan 12, 2024 11:33 am

I'm trying again but just wondered,
If I'm formatting the entire drive and devoting it to puppy why does the tutorial make me install it as frugal?

The full install would be a lot better for large apps etc.

with puppy, you can choose to have your changes, new apps etc. save immediately (as typical with windows) or save on exit, or pupmode13 which many find useful. a full install cannot save changes on exit

also,
with a full install, you need to dedicate a partition to each puppy install but with frugal, you can have multilple puppys on a single partition. useful if you eventually decide to keep windows on your hd