Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Governor wrote: Mon Dec 26, 2022 9:32 am

williwaw wrote: Sun Dec 25, 2022 9:49 pm

the last line might work without the <...> , if placed on the KERNEL_CMDLINE

maybe:

KERNEL_CMDLINE=psubdir=fossapup64_9.5 pmedia=ataflash pfix=fsck psave=nvme0n1p4:fossapup64save
see example line 182

or try it appending a / ie, psave=nvme0n1p4:fossapup64save/
line 184

see my previous post, viewtopic.php?p=76581#p76581 I enclosed the suggestion in a codeblock

mikewalsh wrote: Mon Dec 26, 2022 3:31 pm

My take on the matter is quite simple. If you insist on sticking with FAT32 and NTFS then - at least as far as Linux is concerned - you will just have one problem after another.

This tells me that you're still firmly wedded to Windows, and are applying Windows thinking to your Linux issues.....probably because that's what you've always been used to.

Windows and I are divorced. I am married to Linux now. Before I chose Puppy, I looked briefly at:
Blackarch, Heads, Kodachi, Mint, Nitrux, Parrot, Peppermint, Qubes, Solus, SuperX, Tails, Xubuntu,
Zorin, Alpine, Antix, Arch, Artix, Calculate, Carbs, Devuan, Dragora, Garuda, GNU Guix System, Knoppix,
Manjaro, PcLinuxOS, Puppy, Redcore.

I don't remember which ones I actually tried, but I did not try all of them.

mikewalsh wrote: Mon Dec 26, 2022 3:31 pm

By not using the appropriate file-systems, and setting Puppy up the proper way, you're not giving Puppy a chance to truly shine, and really demonstrate what it's capable of. Yes, as @geo_c says, the save-file system DOES work, but it's something of a mediocre experience at best, and needs an awful lot more TLC & monitoring to keep it functioning as it should.

Here's the deal:
My wife has Windows 10 on her computer. We both need to work on the same files and it is absolutely critical to avoid file corruption when exchanging files. That is my number 1 requirement. We exchange files either by e-mail or via thumb drive or USB HDD. I have now seen several cases of file corruption, so my idea is to use a file system that has nothing to do with symlinks for file storage on an internal partition or any USB connected drive. Apparently exchanging files between ext2,3,4 and FAT32 is not working. If absolutely necessary, I could use a NTFS thumb drive instead of fat32, but only if it is what is needed to avoid corruption, because that would require one extra step.

1)And this is what I keep asking for. I don't care if the OS runs on a special Linux partition - fine if it works. But . . . I need to know if I can download a file to that Linux partition and safely copy it to a different file system without corruption. Someone needs to tell me if there is a way to do this.

2)Or, do I need to download files (non Linux OS related files) directly to a FAT32 drive (or NTFS) in order to avoid file corruption.

In the latter case, I would shrink my Puppy OS partition down quite a bit since I won't be downloading any non-OS related files to it.

Thanks!

But . . . I need to know if I can download a file to that Linux partition and safely copy it to a different file system without corruption. Someone needs to tell me this.

I have 2 ntfs partitions and an ext3 partition. I don't think I have ever had problems copying and moving files between these systems whilst using Puppy. So it's not a problem inherent to the operating system. I have mentioned before that all my Puppy files are located on the ext3 partition and I do all my Puppy operations on this ext3 partition which is a native linux filesystem. Again, I want to recommend and urge you to use the linux partition only for all your Puppy operations. IT IS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO OPERATE YOUR PUPPY FROM AN NTFS OR FAT32 PARTITION. I only use the ntfs partition for long time storage purposes so would occasionally move files to the ntfs partition for longtime storage. I do not use the ntfs partitions for any other Puppy operations, in fact my ntfs partitions are almost never mounted when I'm using Puppy. I only mount the ntfs partitions if I want to access some of the storage files and that would basically be read-only operations. It is possible that the ntfs partition can become corrupted (for instance a power failure when you are busy copying files). I have in the past fixed ntfs issues like this by booting Windows XP to fix that filesystem. When last have you checked the ntfs filesystems for errors with Windows?

amethyst wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:45 am

But . . . I need to know if I can download a file to that Linux partition and safely copy it to a different file system without corruption. Someone needs to tell me if there is a way to do this..

I have 2 ntfs partitions and an ext3 partition. I don't think I have ever had problems copying and moving files between these systems whilst using Puppy. So it's not a problem inherent to the operating system. I have mentioned before that all my Puppy files are located on the ext3 partition and I do all my Puppy operations on this ext3 partition which is a native linux filesystem. Again, I want to recommend and urge you to use the linux partition only for all your Puppy operations. I only use the ntfs partition for long time storage purposes so would occasionally move files to the ntfs partition for longtime storage. I do not use the ntfs partitions for any other Puppy operations, in fact my ntfs partitions are almost never mounted when I'm using Puppy. I only mount the ntfs partitions if I want to access some of the storage files and that would basically be read-only operations. It is possible that the ntfs partition can become corrupted (for instance a power failure when you are busy copying files). I have in the past fixed ntfs issues like this by booting Windows XP to fix that filesystem. When last have you checked the ntfs filesystems for errors with Windows?

I would be happy to use Puppy like that. I would download files (non Linux OS related files) directly to a FAT32 drive (or NTFS) and keep only Linux specific files on the ext partition.
I would shrink my Puppy OS partition down quite a bit since I won't be downloading any non-OS related files to it. Would it make any difference to Puppy if your partitions are NTFS or fat32?

The only NTFS drive i have now is a thumb drive which I used successfully to save an audacity project file to, because Audacity refused to save the file to a fat32 drive. I just checked the NTFS thumb drive on a Windows 10 computer and there were no errors.

amethyst wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:45 am

But . . . I need to know if I can download a file to that Linux partition and safely copy it to a different file system without corruption. Someone needs to tell me if there is a way to do this..

I have 2 ntfs partitions and an ext3 partition. I don't think I have ever had problems copying and moving files between these systems whilst using Puppy. So it's not a problem inherent to the operating system. I have mentioned before that all my Puppy files are located on the ext3 partition and I do all my Puppy operations on this ext3 partition which is a native linux filesystem. Again, I want to recommend and urge you to use the linux partition only for all your Puppy operations. I only use the ntfs partition for long time storage purposes so would occasionally move files to the ntfs partition for longtime storage. I do not use the ntfs partitions for any other Puppy operations, in fact my ntfs partitions are almost never mounted when I'm using Puppy. I only mount the ntfs partitions if I want to access some of the storage files and that would basically be read-only operations. It is possible that the ntfs partition can become corrupted (for instance a power failure when you are busy copying files). I have in the past fixed ntfs issues like this by booting Windows XP to fix that filesystem. When last have you checked the ntfs filesystems for errors with Windows?

I would be happy to use Puppy like that. I would download files (non Linux OS related files) directly to a FAT32 drive (or NTFS) and keep only Linux specific files on the ext partition.
I would shrink my Puppy OS partition down quite a bit since I won't be downloading any non-OS related files to it. Would it make any difference to Puppy if your partitions are NTFS or fat32?

The only NTFS drive i have now is a thumb drive which I used successfully to save an audacity project file to, because Audacity refused to save the file to a fat32 drive. I just checked the NTFS thumb drive on a Windows 10 computer and there were no errors.

FAT32 and especially ntfs partitions are not native to Linux. System operations will work better for these filesystems when working with Windows. It's a good idea to check your fat32 and ntfs partitions every now and then with Windows (which is easy when you have a dual-booting system). i would recommend downloading your files to the linux partition when operating with Puppy. Only mount your fat32 and ntfs partition when you want to move or copy files there or access stored files. When done with the fat32 and ntfs partitions, unmount them. And again, very important and I can't stress it enough: place your entire Puppy operating system on a linux native partition (ext2, ext3 or ext 4). You will just have a more stable, linux friendly, operating environment

amethyst wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:11 am

FAT32 and especially ntfs partitions are not native to Linux. System operations will work better for these filesystems when working with Windows. It's a good idea to check your fat32 and ntfs partitions every now and then with Windows (which is easy when you have a dual-booting system). i would recommend downloading your files to the linux partition when operating with Puppy. Only mount your fat32 and ntfs partition when you want to move or copy files there or access stored files. When done with the fat32 and ntfs partitions, unmount them. And again, very important and I can't stress it enough: place your entire Puppy operating system on a linux native partition (ext2, ext3 or ext 4). You will just have a more stable, linux friendly, operating environment

When the OS is Puppy:
My clear impression is that it is safer to open a file on its fat32 or ntfs partition and work on it and save it where it is, rather than transfer it to an ext2,3,4 partition and work on it and copy it back to the fat32 or ntfs partition. Correct or incorrect?

Are you recommending downloading (or copying?) files directly to the Linux partition, working on them there and copying them to the fat32 or ntfs partition afterwards?
Copying between 2 different file systems sounds risky to me, and I have already experienced file corruption copying from ext4--->fat32--->ext4. Abiword also trashed an .rtf file that I opened on a fat32 drive, but perhaps that was a fluke, I don't know.

When operating with Puppy do all your operations on the linux partition (with linux filesystem) whenever you can. As mentioned before - I only use my ntfs partition for storing files. So I only mount the ntfs partition when I really need to access it (when copying files to it for longterm storage like videos and music) and then I access these files for playing (so when accessing these files it will be a read-only situation only). This is only because I have a dual-booting system with Windows XP (which I only need for printing/scanning because there's no linux driver for my scanner) but since it's installed on an ntfs filesystem and Windows can not access linux filesystems, I also store my longterm files there). So, I have Windows solely for scanning, which I use very little of these days. If it wasn't for scanning, I would not have had Windows on my machine and all my partitions would have been linux partitions (ext2,3,4 filesystems) running Puppy. BTW - Files that are downloaded for short term use are stored on my linux partition (and all my downloads are downloaded to my linux partition).

Governor wrote:

But . . . I need to know if I can download a file to that Linux partition and safely copy it to a different file system without corruption. Someone needs to tell me if there is a way to do this..

amethyst wrote:

I only use the ntfs partition for long time storage purposes so would occasionally move files to the ntfs partition for longtime storage.

Governor wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:26 am

Are you recommending downloading (or copying?) files directly to the Linux partition, working on them there and copying them to the fat32 or ntfs partition afterwards?

amethyst wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:11 am

I would recommend downloading your files to the linux partition when operating with Puppy.

amethyst wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:43 am

Files that are downloaded for short term use are stored on my linux partition (and all my downloads are downloaded to my linux partition).

Governor wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:26 am

Copying between 2 different file systems sounds risky to me, and I have already experienced file corruption copying from ext4--->fat32--->ext4. Abiword also trashed an .rtf file that I opened on a fat32 drive, but perhaps that was a fluke, I don't know.
Almost all of my satellite drives are fat32 and I do not want to put my files in jeopardy.

geo_c wrote:

All that's necessary to use fat32 is learn which files to put on fat32. Just data for instance, not linux systems and linked files. You already found out that Audacity won't let you use fat32.

Governor wrote: Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:36 am

And because every portable app that I downloaded from the @mikewalsh NZ repository were corrupted when I copied them from ext4--->fat32--->ext4.

geo_c wrote:

@mikewalsh's portables make use of linux symlinks. Unix symlinks don't have functionality on fat32. And don't copy back and forth reliably. When the portable runs from another location outside the pupsave, it symlinks the profile and config folders from inside the root directory to where it's located. If you want them to work well, use ext4.

Do @amethyst and I have a speech impediment?

geo_c wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 1:00 pm

Do @amethyst and I have a speech impediment?

Possibly, I have not heard either of you speak.

I am very concerned about corrupted files, so I would like a forum consensus on this.

Is it safer to copy files from a fat32 partition to an ext4 partition, work on them there and copy them back?
Or
Is it safer to work on files on a fat32 partition and save them where they are?

I need to be certain that I choose the safest option.

I would really like to hear from those who have experience doing this, please?

Thanks in advance.

Governor wrote: Tue Dec 27, 2022 1:20 pm

Is it safer to copy files from a fat32 partition to an ext4 partition, work on them there and copy them back?
Or
Is it safer to work on files on a fat32 partition and save them where they are?
Thanks in advance.

The safest option is to store all your files on ext4.

Back them up on fat32, and then you can transfer them to one of those inferior microsoft systems that refuses to read linux filesystems when you need them there. If the file is created in fat32, copy it to your ext4 system to work, AND store it. You'll have two copies. That's how you hedge against any file corruption which can happen for all kinds of stupid reasons like a USB plug getting buggy.

It's that simple. The answer won't change no matter how many times you ask it.

Your safest option is to do ALL your Puppy operations on the linux partition and to avoid using the fat32 and ntfs partitions as far as you can. I re-confirm: my ntfs partitions are always unmounted and I only mount it when absolutely necessary (and in that case I unmount it again whenever I've finished using it).