How to go into developer mode in chromebook with bad keyboard?

[mouldy]

Reading more about the early 14in HP Stream like mine think its 14-ax010ca Anyway the bios doesnt support nvme. And nice workaround with rEFInd-duet, guy in video gave a link, just need the EFI folder out of it, has the nvme driver included.

But then some guy posted that he got it working by going into bios and setting it to try and boot from "network" first. Sounds goofy but honestly have yet to see any bios written by a sane person, the mrchromebox UEFI bios maybe comes closest. Most bios seem more likely to have been written by Mad Hatter from Alice in Wonderland. I remember some of weirdness in getting older bioses to boot frm usb, when that was a new thing. Some it was easiest to set to boot from floppy or cd and stick in PLOP disk. Boot PLOP and let it find the usb. That one guy said booting first from network worked on his without rEFInd-duet or CLOVER. Course he was ignored, though I will try it. So just depend which adapter I get first. This Stream like the Dell chromebook has M.2 wifi socket, not mpcie. Oh and it can take upto 8GB RAM. The 14inch all had soccketed RAM, just one but socket none the less. Older ones can take max of 8GB. Guess newest ones have two sockets and can max at 32GB DDR4. Honestly with celeron cant imagine any of them actually needing/using more than 8GB. Though suppose if you have 24 tabs open in your browser or some fool thing like that. 8GB of DDR3 less than $10, so be worth it just out of curiosity whether it makes a difference. With Puppy, probably not, with window, likely would. Processor going to be the bottleneck once storage and RAM are upgraded.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Most of the duet/refind and clover stuff you can download from the web won't work OOTB, you've got to jerk it around first. For your HP, the duer/refind that I posted should be plug and play, the clover/refind one is only for MBR bios.

Took the back off my Lenovo 100s-14ibr cloudbook today, read that some of them had m.2 m-key slots. Yipee, mine does so can put in NVME without an adapter, to bad the ram can't be upgraded, stuck at 2gb.

wizard

[mouldy]

@mouldy

Most of the duet/refind and clover stuff you can download from the web won't work OOTB, you've got to jerk it around first. For your HP, the duer/refind that I posted should be plug and play, the clover/refind one is only for MBR bios.

Took the back off my Lenovo 100s-14ibr cloudbook today, read that some of them had m.2 m-key slots. Yipee, mine does so can put in NVME without an adapter, to bad the ram can't be upgraded, stuck at 2gb.

wizard

Thats lucky to have m.2 slot meant for nvme. You should get lot more speed out of it like that. The m.2 wifi socket is much more limited. Still dumbest thing ever to limit upgrades to such an extreme. I think part of it was Microsoft basically giving them win10 license free if computer was made to their specs. M$ wanted something to compete with Chromebooks. Cause using socketed RAM and offering a m.2 socket for nvme would cost next to nothing. Even if its initially sold with both small amounts RAM and small amount storage. Both Google and Microsoft wanted to herd people to renting space in the "cloud".

[rcrsn51]

The primary market for Chromebooks has always been schools. The last thing that school boards want is a machine that can be pried open by kids and stripped of any removable parts. The more stuff you can solder down the better. What hobbyists may eventually do with the used machines is not a big concern.

Microsoft's idea that they could compete in this market with a Windows machine was stupid from the beginning.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Microsoft's idea that they could compete in this market with a Windows machine was stupid from the beginning.

Absolutely, and Apple too, they both had no insight into how fill the Education markets needs. Googles approach should be a marketing "case history" study. They controlled the hardware spec and developed a new OS for the market.

wizard

[mouldy]

The primary market for Chromebooks has always been schools. The last thing that school boards want is a machine that can be pried open by kids and stripped of any removable parts. The more stuff you can solder down the better. What hobbyists may eventually do with the used machines is not a big concern.

Microsoft's idea that they could compete in this market with a Windows machine was stupid from the beginning.

Yes and Google limited updates originally to 5 year I think. Generating disposable e-waste using lot rare earth minerals, without an end use is stupid. But think of all the cell phones with people buying a new one on the easy payment plan every year or two. Think of all the resources wasted. A well made cell phone should last minimum of ten year. At least come up with a way to recycle the stuff though reuse is much better. I gotta say I am actually using that little converted Dell chromebook now with the nvme drive. 256GB makes LOT difference as does that nvme being faster than the eMMC. Its minimal far as the celeron used in it. I still am not impressed with keyboards on any of the cheapies. Well the Asus C300m keyboard is maybe best I have tried on the cheapies. The keyboard on the Streams seriously sucks as does the trackpad. They went ultra cheapo crappo on that. If I wanted to do any serious typing or even use it as typical home workstation, have to use a usb keyboard and mouse. the built in stuff only usable for occasional portable use. It really wouldnt have cost much more to actually up the quality enough to make them pleasant to use.

Back in the day of the early netbooks, didnt M$ offer an truncated "starter" version of win7. Not sure why they didnt do that with win10 on the cloudbooks though guess win10 wasnt about selling an operating system but selling services and collecting info to no doubt sell. Thats why win11 goes out of its way to try and force you to create a microsoft account just to set up the computer. What I dont understand this assumes that the drivers are there before the user has access to the system. If you need to install special drivers or software for your connection, you are screwed. Though of course last I knew there are workaround but seriously esoteric ones that arent obvious. I mean setting it up as an "educational computer" as a workaround, really? I think M$ has already plugged most of the other workarounds. And that "S" version nonsense. Trying to force you to establish a Microsoft account to go to the "Store" to get whatever to convert it to regular home version. Course again are workaround. I read easiest is to go into bios, undo secure boot, reboot and it should be gone. You can then reset secure boot if you so desire and it stays out of S mode. Windows probably reset it eventually anyway.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Think the best thing ever done was figuring out how to permanently disable Windows updates. Used to get paid a lot of money to undo the havoc it caused.

wizard

[mouldy]

@mouldy

Think the best thing ever done was figuring out how to permanently disable Windows updates. Used to get paid a lot of money to undo the havoc it caused.

wizard

Thats what I liked about that windowsxlite.com versions. He offers packages of actual important security updates, so no need to let Microsoft autoupdate with all the crap "feature" and drivers updates. His versions of windows are not perfect, but cool what one guy can do to improve windows. Something a huge corporation cant seem to do. Course all he really did was make it an operating system only, not all this marketing and data collections stuff. I am still not particularly fond of windows, but his versions are at least pretty usable without lot bloat. Microsoft of course makes this painful by only supporting a particular version for only short time. In other words should be like windows98 if every major change is counted as basically a new system. Wait guess thats already been used.... LOL Ok, windows 198.

[mouldy]

Ok, my old Sony stand alone dvdplayer went to electronics heaven last night. It owed me nothing. I was trying to remember how old, its at a minimum 15year old, I remember buying it new. Before it, I never had one go more than two year. To finish the movie, first tried the converted Dell chromebook with usb dvdrom and hdmi to the tv. It would play the movie but oddly no sound. Yes it makes sound playing frozen-bubble game and watching youtube. But not playing a dvd. Go figure. So got the Stream and yea watched rest of movie using it. I have enough old computers that will never be used other than experiment once in blue moon, so thinking a desktop computer work better as an ersatz dvdplayer. I have an old desktop that proudly says win95 on side, but the motherboard is from a much newer Compaq 100b all in one. Has AMD E350, the low end and slow wonder circa 2011, the supposed Atom killer. Havent lugged it downstairs yet but think its what I will use. Has only a tiny super quiet fan. I was curious how AMD E350 compares to the Celeron N2840 in the converted chromebook. Oddly very similar:

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/I ... 086vsm5356

I am rather surprised. Thought the E350 would be significantly slower. Alas think only way I could use a NVME on it would be via USB and pretty sure no USB3. So no real way to try it head to head with the Dell. But for use as an ersatz dvd player doesnt matter. Small SATA drive be fine. Heck a thumb drive would work. Just need way to boot Puppy. That plus a wireless mouse in lieu of a remote.

[wizard]

@mouldy

At one time I had a Dell d400, Pentium D connected to the TV using VGA + audio cable. Had VNC installed so I could remote control it from another laptop on the couch. Could stream YT, local .mp4 files or play DVD's'. Replaced it when Chromecast came along.

Thnaks
wizard

[mouldy]

Well rainy day so played with it. Think the AMD E350 is officially dead. It did boot once and BookwormPup had too new of a kernel for the video card it used. Got this really low resolution screen with NO other options. But after that when I push the power button it flashes and immediately turns off. Even after setting long time. Not a big loss. Another motherboard around here that needs a new home so it can take over the Everex win95 case I guess. It just has loud fan. Think its a core2duo, well hope it is and not a P4. Yea has to be a core2duo cause it can take 8GB RAM.

But for kicks tried an old thin client. It has a 3.6GB storage drive, 1.5G RAM and a single core AMD with one thread processor. Meaning it can boot 64bit. BookwormPup64 on it. Had to download VLC, the two that came with Puppy didnt work well with DVD menus and mouse. Some of those movie dvds have really goofy menus. Supposed to be cute, but really just PITA. VLC lot more reliable. Anyway thats the one. Its too slow for internet but it does fine playing dvds with good screen resolution. Glad it will get some use. Been setting on my desk forever. Significant number of my old computer hoard are just too old to ever be much use. Or cost more to fix them than just buying much more powerful used computer.

[wizard]

@mouldy

goofy menus. Supposed to be cute, but really just PITA. VLC lot more reliable

.

One of the reasons to rip a DVD into a .mp4 file, gets rid of the menus and goes straight to play. VLC is my choice for muti-media, can do almost anything.

wizard

[mouldy]

Wish they would stop offering me these super cheap EOL chromebooks. They are kinda hard to resist. Must be an incredible surplus of them to sell that cheap. As long as keyboard works, dont find them particularly hard to convert via mrchromebox. Got another. HP 14-SMB which wasnt easy to get info so was a bit of a pig in a poke. Interestingly must be a later version as Pup says it has Google Falco motherboard with celeron 2955U, and it has 4GB RAM and even 32GB eMMC. Writing from it now via BookwormPup. Keyboard not bad. I like this one better than the Stream. I even booted MINT from a dvd and it could smoothly play youtube videos. This one probably could handle mini windows ok. That would be good test whether windows could play youtube videos smoothly. Yea definitely a better processor than the N2840. Noticed though it had a mpcie wifi card. I thought that was odd and a little fan which seems unusual in cheapo chromebooks or Streams.

[wizard]

@mouldy

The 2955u has a Passmark v9=1372, so good jump from before. Usually a score of 1200+ is going to work decent.

wizard

[mouldy]

Well I am getting an education in celerons. Friend of mine in neighboring state had her SGIN X15 laptop go fubar. With windows going into perpetual repair mode. Apparently common on these reading reviews. It has a Celeron N5095. Thats a new one on me. Apparently 11th generation celeron and a passmark score similar to second generation i5. So nothing to sneeze at. Though its also trying deal with win11, so... She said it did fine upto now. Anyway offered to try and walk her through reinstalling win11, (or send her a converted chromebook or or two or even the Stream), but she is thinking just mail me the laptop. So get to play with something else. From her description and reading the reviews. Its either an el cheapo wonky m.2 SSD or some automated windows update thing that fubar'd win11. Whats bad is this is basically a generic computer with a name slapped on it. I found drivers for an older model SGIN M15, but none for the X15 version. Think the M version had a N4020. Maybe same drivers, maybe not. Found some conversation online one guy had to track down the actual manufacturer and they sent the drivers. He didnt share them or do anything but offer the email address, which somebody later in thread said bounced email now. I will of course first try to resurrect existing install of win11, but if I have to start over will first try linux and see if it has driver for the trackpad, that is the one bit hardware impossible without that manufacture's driver. Least maybe I can find out who manufactured the trackpad via linux. If it supports all hardware, tempted to put MINT or whatever works on it, though doubt she would be happy. Be nice if she would actually try it, but probably not. Some folk have to have their windows fix cause thats what is familiar. Really doubt she does more than browser stuff with it. But just try to convince somebody that Firefox/Chrome are pretty much universal whatever the operating system.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Should be interesting. You might try imaging the current W11 with Aomei backup, then restoring it to another computer to see if will run. If it does, just reverse the process and it might heal itself. Also, there used to be utilities that could extract drivers from a installed system, worth a try. If you get it running, I'd do your friend a favor and disable updates.

wizard

[mouldy]

She hasnt got it mailed yet, but the driver thing is worrisome, so been looking more into that.

https://www.techspot.com/guides/1714-ex ... s-drivers/

Now if I can boot Puppy and mount the windows drive. Hoping its not too protected. I know after it became kinda popular using a live linux dvd or usb to modify windows, they started building in protections against this. Though pretty sure her drive shouldnt be encrypted unless they do this automatically anymore. Guessing she just used it as it came when new and then whatever updates Microsoft did. Puppy be easiest but if I have to do it the windows way so be it. If I can make copy of the drivers, will burn to dvd and send it back with the laptop. Though dont know she has a usb dvd, but at least the drivers be available if it went wonky again.

Oh I had forgotten, had given her an old Turion64 laptop for emergency use some years ago when her computer went wonky. Had forgotten about it and dont think she ever used it. Had put a very locked down win10 on it as win10 marginal on it, no resources for all the fluff and M$ malarchy, and Slacko 6.9.9.9. as an afterthought so must been like 4 year ago? She got that out and actually got windows booted on it. Said battery completely dead (well its set for years now) Its of course slow, but she installed current Opera, guess she likes Opera. And told me its usable. I am going to refresh my memory about Slacko, think it had kernel 4.19 so it might be able to run a current browser. Though not sure I want to try and explain this. Its old and heavy (being heavy is her big complaint about it) so not worth mailing it. Cant even remember what it looked like so no idea how complicated to just remove the hard drive. Yea pretty sure it had an old mechanical hard drive.

[wizard]

@mouldy

just remove the hard drive

Been there, done that by phone, can turn into a nightmare.

wizard

[mouldy]

Well she said the SGIN is packaged up ready for post office. I found a review on one of the SGIN listings on Amazon, that some guy said MX21.3 supports all the hardware on this exact model, so guess current MX23.3 support it too. And probably current MINT and even BookwormPup. Thats a good thing and means I can borrow a bit of the SSD and install linux so if windows fubars again, she has a backup system.

Oh used lnxrouter script to convert my Easytether usb connection to ethernet, and connected an old D430 laptop with BookwormPup to my desktop via ethernet cable. It just automatically sees eth0 and uses it. Ok, so boot Slacko7 from dvd and try it, same thing, it automatically sees and uses it. So suppose its possible that old Dell Latitude with Turion64, had some oddball ethernet card that Slacko couldnt use? The card itself works cause she can use it with win10.

[wizard]

@mouldy

used lnxrouter script to convert my Easytether usb connection to ethernet

What is this?

Thanks
wizard

[mouldy]

@mouldy

used lnxrouter script to convert my Easytether usb connection to ethernet

What is this?

Thanks
wizard

https://github.com/garywill/linux-router

This is more elaborate version inspired by the older create_ap script. Create_ap only does wifi. Lnxrouter does everything. But of course is bigger. I usually still use create_ap but used lnxrouter for something before and was impressed, and remembered it can create eth0. Only way I will have an ethernet connection to experiment with. I wanted to test if Puppy and if Slacko in particular can do ethernet automatically. And they can.

I said "convert" but more like it can share any existing connection on linux computer with another computer in particular way, wifi, ethernet, etc. Create a local non-internet adhoc network and the like. Really makes something that otherwise be a royal PITA to something pretty trivial.

[mouldy]

Got the SGIN in mail today (yea on Memorial Day, who knew), but anyway wasted whole lot time with it. The 500GB M.2 SATA ssd is wonky. Gparted can see it and its partitions (it took long time to do so), but cant touch it. I put it in usb adapter and micro 11 could see it and I got that "Drivers Store" folder copied. But the user folder was corrupt, windows couldnt open it.

So thats it, needs new SSD or rather good used one. Wouldnt put lot money into this thing. But $15 for a used 256GB SSD, sure. By way it loves full version Ubuntu (and KLV Airedale) both booted via Ventoy, Knoppix worked well but not as fast as those two, but it hates MX, so... if I were putting linux on it for my friend would probably do MINT. No linux I tried, even couple older ones had any problem with the hardware, so guessing neither would a new install of windows. Just think of this as a 15inch "hp stream" only with 12GB RAM and a socketed SSD. And maybe less quality control at factory.

This wonky ssd thing seems common on these from reviews I read, though lot people dont really diagnose it, dont think they sell lot of these to computer nerds. more to people that are just buying an appliance at lowest cost and toss it when the magic smoke escapes. I imagine whoever manufactures these sourced the absolute cheapest noname 500GB SSD they could find. In world of cheap laptops with 32GB eMMC, this does appeal. No brand name of course. Heck the laptop doesnt even have logo on it. Pure generic.

[Federico]

For going into developer mode just once, you most probably just need to connect an external Mac type USB keyboard.
Some keyboards come in 2 flavours: PC and Mac (like the famous Logitech MX Keys for example).
Obviously this could also be a permanent solution in case you plan to use the laptop as a desktop, on a desk and without moving it (maybe also with an external screen).
Otherwise, the internal built-in keyboard will anyway need to be repaired or replaced.

[mouldy]

For going into developer mode just once, you most probably just need to connect an external Mac type USB keyboard.
Some keyboards come in 2 flavours: PC and Mac (like the famous Logitech MX Keys for example).
Obviously this could also be a permanent solution in case you plan to use the laptop as a desktop, on a desk and without moving it (maybe also with an external screen).
Otherwise, the internal built-in keyboard will anyway need to be repaired or replaced.

Thats an interesting idea. I hadnt seen that suggested before and I read lot stuff online about trying to get into developer mode with bad chromebook keyboard. But since I dont own one, suspect the purchase cost of the apple keyboard would be greater than cost of the laptop. So you are saying the "reload" key on a chromebook keyboard is wired/mapped different than the F3 key on windows keyboard, but is same as whatever that key is on a Mac keyboard?

I am not chromebook guy by any stretch, but I think that key with circular arrow that corresponds to F3 key on windows keyboard is to reload page in chromeos?? So guess one test would be when booted into chromeos, attach a usb windows keyboard and press F3 key. If it reloads the page, then its the same and not going to make any difference using a usb Mac keyboard. Oh just took quick look and genuine usb Apple keyboard that works is going around $15 on ebay. The broken ones go for not much less than that??? Begs question as to what exactly does one do with a broken apple keyboard... Cheaper just to buy another working EOL $10 chromebook, LOL

Oh well the Samsung doesnt owe me anything. Finding it had android emulator built in and could download apps from Google Store was interesting and that the chromeos android emulator could run latest Kindle4Android ok. So if nothing else one could use it as a Kindle reader.... The current android Firefox also ran ok though I am not a fan of any android browser without touch screen, they are bit oddball to navigate when using mouse and keyboard.

[mouldy]

I got the SSD for my friends SGIN laptop today. Easy peasy installing win11 except for that stupid trackpad driver. Ok I get to the format part of installation, no trackpad. Fine use a mouse. Then during installation with the assembling and installing files with the checkmarks stuff, guess what, the trackpad works! Then when its finished and I am in win11 desktop, no more trackpad. Some other missing drivers but whatever generic stuff windows used seems to work ok I guess. You cant find out diddly with windows about specific hardware. I booted Puppy from thumbdrive. Its a Synaptics 3602 trackpad. Of course nothing is simple in windows anymore. SGIN website has no drivers for their X15 models just for their M15 model and it doesnt work.

Windows device manager says it cant do anything and gives up searching after only half hearted attempt. Useless piece of ... And nobody offers generic hardware drivers for window anymore. When you think you found something its some kind of upgrade drivers for money scam. Oh I tried subbing that "Drivers Store" folder I copied from the old SSD. Umm, nope, locked everything up. made it read only, and I had to reinstall win11 again. Doesnt help that everybody has some different shorthand for what this is called, so makes searching lot more difficult. In old days you just downloaded an inf file, pointed windows at it and voila, it worked.

[mouldy]

Ok, on the windowsXlite.com site, there is a suggestion for a windows driver updater. There is a free version that works, but watch ever so closely or it tries to install bunch crapware.

Anyway it did its thing and downloaded like 2GB of driver stuff. And it got the trackpad working

Device HID\SYNA3602&Col02\5&286ea3df&0&0001 was configured.

Driver Name: input.inf
Driver Package ID: input.inf_amd64_a56ca3d2bfcebd88
Class GUID: {745a17a0-74d3-11d0-b6fe-00a0c90f57da}
Driver Date: 06/21/2006
Driver Version: 10.0.26100.1
Driver Provider: Microsoft
Driver Section: HID_Raw_Inst.NT
Driver Rank: 0xFF1004
Matching Device ID: HID_DEVICE_UP:000D_U:0005
Outranked Drivers: input.inf:HID_DEVICE:00FF1005
Device Updated: false
Parent Device: ACPI\SYNA3602\4&411fb75&0

And now in device manager, doesnt show any uninstalled stuff. Still seems crazy messed up way to do drivers, but guess this is how its done in windows world anymore.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Great work there mo, perseverance pays off. Have had to trick MS into working on lots of old hardware.

Thanks
wizard

[mouldy]

I dont know if she will be best pleased, stole some space on back end of the SSD and made a linux partition. MINT installer wasnt having any of it so just installed BookwormPup. Then added chainloader menuentry so windows will automatically start loading if Puppy isnt selected within 4 seconds. Saves having to push F7 and go through all that to boot windows. Told her I would walk her through nuking Puppy if she needs the space. But this gives her an option if windows goes fubar.

[wizard]

@mouldy

Did you use the xlite W11 on the SGIN?

Thanks
wizard

[mouldy]

@mouldy

Did you use the xlite W11 on the SGIN?

Thanks
wizard

Yea the 24H2 Optimum "home" one, not the micro "elf theme" one. I had downloaded the official m$ version, all 7GB of it. But it was corrupted when I went to install it. Didnt want to download it again. I have limited monthly data. She had win11 home on the SGIN so the Optimum "home" one activated soon as I went online with it. She said she would rather not have all the "annoying Cortana stuff" anyway. Think lot people just want an operating system, not a forced "win experience/sideshow" with all the fluff/cruft. "See Bill Gates bite the head off a live chicken..." I think she will be happy enough with the Optimum. I hope she at least tries BookwormPup. I was going to put MINT on there at the end of the SSD, cause it probably feel little more familiar to casual windows user. But its installer wasnt cooperative.