Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Federico,
It seems that your problem is the flathub is not getting registered correctly, due to "unacceptable TLS certificate".
There are heaps of bug report about this, with some suggestions to fix, for example:

https://itsfoss.com/unacceptable-tls-ce ... ror-linux/

https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/65284

https://github.com/flathub/flathub/issues/2580

https://discourse.flathub.org/t/unaccep ... lution/716

But why is only flathub plagued with this problem?

In /usr/local/flatpak/flatpak, this code is failing:

 if [ ! -d /mnt/wkg/flatpak/repo ];then
  flatpak remote-add --if-not-exists flathub https://flathub.org/repo/flathub.flatpakrepo
  if [ $? -ne 0 ];then
   rm -rf /mnt/wkg/flatpak 2>/dev/null
   M3b="$(gettext 'ERROR: Failure registering with Flathub repository.')"
   popup "terminate=ok background=#ff8080 level=top process=wait|<big>${M3b}</big>"
   exec flapi
  fi
 fi

Specifically:

 flatpak remote-add --if-not-exists flathub https://flathub.org/repo/flathub.flatpakrepo

So I suppose if you delete /mnt/wkg/flatpak, then try to find why the above command is failing.

Federico wrote: ↑Thu Jun 29, 2023 6:55 pm

Therefore, I'm starting to think that all KDE applications distributed as flatpaks may only be run on the KDE, that is: on distributions running the KDE. This would mean that the way I went, installing all the packages from the Debian repo, is the only possible way at the moment. If I'm wrong please do not esitate to inform me.

Yes you are wrong. Flatpaks are standalone, with everything builtin. kde flatpaks work ok.

It is @Tessel who also reported this "unacceptable tls" problem, in Easy 5.3.1:

viewtopic.php?p=90892#p90892

I'm puzzled, why just you two?

Hmmm, long shot, but could you try boot a pristine system in English?
Just to eliminate choice of language as the cause.

The same "tls unacceptable" error reported with fossapup:

viewtopic.php?t=5523

...and they have reported that this works:

flatpak remote-add --if-not-exists flathub https://dl.flathub.org/repo/flathub.flatpakrepo

...but not completely...

viewtopic.php?t=8270

I can use any file manager except ROX.

Hi,

you could download KDE applications from here, and try to install on EasyOS.

https://www.trinitydesktop.org/applicat ... #utilities

I only guess that there are less dependencies than in the KDE Plasma version, coz TDE is build on KDE3. Maybe less problems?

@ Barry

I have good and bad news.
I have found the reason for the malfunction. In order to accept the TLS certificate Internet time must be activated in the system. Therefore, if Internet time is not activated Flapi cannot work correctly. One could add a warning for that. This would be appropriate in my opinion.

So I managed to install both Dolphin and Okular. But, unfortunately there are important limitations for them when running as flatpaks, the major of which is that they cannot access the Windows NTFS partition of the PC.

I'm going to test flatpacked Dolphin extensively and report a complete list of missing features when compared to a direct installation.

@ all

you can install Dolphin and Okular as flatpaks, just remember to activate Internet Time on Quick Setup before running Flapi. Stay tuned to know exactly what works and what not.

just curious if you have the "Hardware Clock set to UTC" check box ticked?

are you saying you can see the contents of the ntfs partition with ROX but not Dolphin? Try clicking on the icon in the lower left and making sure the partition is mounted before trying to access with Dolphin

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 5:45 am

just curious if you have the "Hardware Clock set to UTC" check box ticked?

are you saying you can see the contents of the ntfs partition with ROX but not Dolphin? Try clicking on the icon in the lower left and making sure the partition is mounted before trying to access with Dolphin

1) No, it is not set.

2) I'm not so unexpert: of course the partition is mounted and I can browse its contents through Rox Filer but not through Dolphin (shows empty folder). The same happens with Okular, which can't open PDFs from the NTFS partition even if drag and dropped. The only way to open PDFs from the MS partition is to copy them locally first.

3) I'm tired. It's morning here and I didn't sleep. I'll post this list of non working features, then I'll have to sleep a little bit.

Non-working features on flatpak-ed Okular:

- PDFs located on other partitions cannot be accessed. Even drag and drop does not work. The only way is to copy them locally first. This may be very annoying for people using EasyOS on USB sticks.

Non-working features on flatpak-ed Dolphin:

- The program works in read only mode on the whole FS, it can only write on /files and /home/Dolphin.
- The /root folder is neither shown nor accessible. This is probably due to the fact that it runs through a new user named Dolphin , and may be quite annoying for people used to customize the system frequently (/root/Startup , /root/jwmrc-tray etc...).
- All mounted partitions are inaccessible (shown as being empty).
- Opening a text file looks to be impossible.
- This one is really strange! Most data shown on /usr/share/applications is wrong / different / non-existent, and also not modifyable. It cannot be found on the main partition when searched with Rox-Filer or pFind. It looks like these data only exists in RAM, inside Dolphin's memory bubble (like the Breeze and Breeze-dark icon themes).
- File associations management is totally missing, whereas the directly installed version is able to manage associations not only for itself but even for the whole system.
- The Open with context menu entry is missing. When double clicking a file only a limited set of applications is shown and the user cannot independently choose another app.
- Built-in icons inside the flatpak cannot be used for customizing the look of buttons.

Apart from these, both software are working fine.

Try running dolphin as root:

# dolphin.bin

I am planning to include a simple way to set the default for apps to be run as either their own user or as root.

BarryK wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 10:32 am

Try running dolphin as root:

Code: Select all

# dolphin.bin

I am planning to include a simple way to set the default for apps to be run as either their own user or as root.

Oh, good morning! Ehm... good afternoon!
For sure! I was thinking about that, but I was so tired yesterday, ehm... in the morning, that I didn't even manage to type any more on the keyboard.
I've run it as root and some problems went away, but I also discovered others.

So, when run as root, it looks like these are the remaining non-working features:

Non-working features on flatpak-ed Okular (run as root):

- PDFs located on other partitions cannot be accessed. Even drag and drop does not work. The only way is to copy them locally first. This may be very annoying for people using EasyOS on USB sticks.

Non-working features on flatpak-ed Dolphin (run as root):

- All mounted partitions are inaccessible (shown as being empty)
- File associations management is totally missing, whereas the directly installed version is able to manage associations not only for itself but even for the whole system.
- The Open with context menu entry is missing. When double clicking a file, only a limited set of applications is shown and the user cannot independently choose another app.
- Opening a text file is impossible, since no app is proposed for doing that and when the user presses the Find more software button, Dolphin says that the Child process gnome-software couldn't be executed.
- This one is really strange! Most data shown on /usr/share/applications is wrong / different / non-existent, and also not modifyable. It cannot be found on the main partition when searched with Rox-Filer or pFind. It looks like these data only exists in RAM, inside Dolphin's memory bubble (as well as the Breeze and Breeze-dark icon themes).
- Built-in icons inside the flatpak cannot be used for customizing the look of buttons.

And that's it. It would be beautiful to see these flatpak-ed apps work fully / correctly, like their normally installed counterparts, but anyway, it looks like the purpose of this thread has been achieved, because at this point everyone can decide if to use these flatpak-ed versions or to go for a direct installation, according to the own needs (jet more beautiful would be to see Okular and Dolphin directly installable from the official repository, or even pre-installed inside the system).

nice to see you have the flatpacks working, Federico.
fwiw, I migrated to Easy from fedora29 KDE a few years back. I liked KDE in general, but Dolphin, in spite of being full featured, was troublesome in similar ways when run as a user, and seemed to only be useful when run as root. There must have been some additional hassles also, in addition to having to open a terminal and su to root in order to run dolphin as root. Its been a while and my memory is a bit fuzzy, but "sudo dolphin" as I recall didnt quite work well either...
I do recall well the issues were enough for me to take a second look at puppy, and Easy. File managers being so tightly integrated with desktops, I find it hard simply add a file manager as an additional app and make it work well without some headaches. That said, I do use midnight commander as an alternative to Rox for some chores.
Hope you find a way to get Ocular the permissions it needs, its a nice app.

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 3:18 pm

nice to see you have the flatpacks working, Federico.
fwiw, I migrated to Easy from fedora29 KDE a few years back. I liked KDE in general, but Dolphin, in spite of being full featured, was troublesome in similar ways when run as a user, and seemed to only be useful when run as root. There must have been some additional hassles also, in addition to having to open a terminal and su to root in order to run dolphin as root. Its been a while and my memory is a bit fuzzy, but "sudo dolphin" as I recall didnt quite work well either...
I do recall well the issues were enough for me to take a second look at puppy, and Easy. File managers being so tightly integrated with desktops, I find it hard simply add a file manager as an additional app and make it work well without some headaches. That said, I do use midnight commander as an alternative to Rox for some chores.
Hope you find a way to get Ocular the permissions it needs, its a nice app.

Hi, thank you very much for having shared your thoughts and experiences. I did already so at the beginning of this thread. Basically, the reason why we were so fine with Dolphin on Easy is exactly that EasyOS only works with the root user and therefore there's no need of using any sudo command to run it as root. When installed directly (and correctly), it also integrates itself incredibly well within the system, with all the context menu entries, the possibility to open a file with any of the installed apps, and even the ability to manage file associations for the whole system, that means that if we tell Dolphin to open a certain file extension with a certain app, the same app will be used for files with that extension even when using other file managers.
Everyone has own needs when using file managers, which may differ according to the type of use. I will for sure try out also Midnight Commander. Thank you!

the flatpack was built by the KDE project, most likely with KDE desktop defaults.
maybe there is a config file from your deb install you can use in the flatpak?

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 4:39 pm

the flatpack was built by the KDE project, most likely with KDE desktop defaults.
maybe there is a config file from your deb install you can use in the flatpak?

As far as I understood, pre-packaged apps have all dependencies buit-in --> they do not interact with packages installed on the system (work in a sandboxed way).

If I understand correctly, your dolphin built from debs is configured better than the dolphin run from a flatpak?

I dunno where in /root the configuration is stored in the install made from debs, but if you find it, you might be able copy it to the configs for the flatpak install

https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... tion-files

maybe some relevant info here also
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/713 ... and-export

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 5:26 pm

If I understand correctly, your dolphin built from debs is configured better than the dolphin run from a flatpak?

I dunno where in /root the configuration is stored in the install made from debs, but if you find it, you might be able copy it to the configs for the flatpak install

https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... tion-files

It works much better, and since more than 2 years ago.
It's not a matter of configuration - the configuration is almost blank - it's a matter of interaction with the system.
Here I've written down what doesn't work, when compared to my Dolphin built from debs:

https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 895#p92895

I think that the point of the question here is that if the purpose is to have a very powerful and flexible file manager, it must somehow interact deeply with the system, offering context menus and outline features (and regarding this I remind you that the Windows Explorer is even a working FTP client by itself). For this reason it cannot be either a very small / basic app or run in a sandbox. I know that Barry loves Rox, and that it's also possible to configure it in such a way that it works similarly to Dolphin but, it is anyway not nearly as comfortable as Dolphin when used for office work, imho.

It's not a matter of configuration - the configuration is almost blank - it's a matter of interaction with the system.

I am suggesting the flatpack is configured to work/interact with the KDE desktop, so a default or mostly "blank" config might work better

https://userbase.kde.org/Dolphin

williwaw wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 6:13 pm

I am suggesting the flatpack is configured to work/interact with the KDE desktop, so a default or mostly "blank" config might work better

https://userbase.kde.org/Dolphin

Maybe, even though I don't think so, since it even shows non-existent data on certain folders. I'll have a look anyway. The only thing that works better on the flatpak-ed version are the animations... but those things are for people more interested in aesthetics than efficiency, imho.

in spite of the official looking kde "verified" blue checkmark on Dolphin page at the flathub site, it looks as if details about the flatpack itself can be found by clicking on "Manifest" and issues can be reviewed at a github page
https://github.com/flathub/org.kde.dolphin/issues

re drag and drop: check manifest for ocular too

Federico wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 5:56 pm

It's not a matter of configuration - the configuration is almost blank - it's a matter of interaction with the system.

Sounds like might be user permissions related. If run as a certain user may only have sufficient access rights for that user?

wiak wrote: ↑Fri Jun 30, 2023 11:59 pm

Sounds like might be user permissions related. If run as a certain user may only have sufficient access rights for that user?

Flatpak-ed Dolphin may be run either as root or as user Dolphin: in both situations no data is shown when entering mount-points of other partitions. I've tested that this doesn't happen just for the Windows partition, but also for any other mounted drive. Basically, this looks to be something like a simplified version of Dolphin, which strictly works only on the local FS.

I will try to investigate on this in the next hours, but I honestly don't think that anything can be done since this is a sandboxed app.

And anyway, this is just one of the issues: no one who really use the system can live without comfortable context menus, applications and associations management. How to open a text file, for example? For sure you can do it with drag and drop... but how uncomfortable is that?

https://github.com/flathub/org.kde.dolphin/issues/61

https://github.com/flathub/org.kde.dolp ... 0cf189e835

A fix for when Flapi fails to register with flathub.org:

https://bkhome.org/news/202307/flapi-fi ... athub.html

BarryK wrote: ↑Sat Jul 01, 2023 10:39 am

A fix for when Flapi fails to register with flathub.org:

https://bkhome.org/news/202307/flapi-fi ... athub.html

Hi Barry, thank you!

You personally suggested me the reason of the troubles with Flapi and the TLS certificate in this post: https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 851#p92851

I have read this link, which you provided me: https://itsfoss.com/unacceptable-tls-ce ... ror-linux/

and as you can see, about in the middle of the page they suggest to enable Automatic Date & Time . This has probably something to do with how TLS certificates are verified / handled on the internet.

What probably happens is that if your time is perfect or almost perfect you don't get any errors, even if you are not time-syncing. But if you are just some seconds off, the problematic arises.

I have further modified Flapi to offer to sync time with Internet if registration with flathub fails.

I have reported the fix to the flathub issues site:

https://github.com/flathub/flathub/issues/2580

BarryK wrote: ↑Sun Jul 02, 2023 1:10 am

I have further modified Flapi to offer to sync time with Internet if registration with flathub fails.

I have reported the fix to the flathub issues site:

https://github.com/flathub/flathub/issues/2580

Fantastic! Thank you very much from me and the whole community!

This topic has almost reached the 1000 visualizations threshold. And this was quite was unexpected from my side. This means that many people are also interested in having the possibility to use KDE apps on Easy.

At this point, I also start thinking about a KDE version of EasyOS. Just an idea. I don't know if the KDE is able to work with just the root user but, wouldn't it be beautiful? What do you all think about it?

@Federico

I don't really think the number of views means a lot. I look at plenty of threads about bits of software, just out of interest, or to see if I can help. Doesn't mean I want to use it myself. The Okular flatpack works fine for me, and it looks very nice, but I don't need it and it have removed it. KDE would offer nothing extra for me - there are other distros I could use if I wanted it.

@Federico you may want to check out this

https://bkhome.org/news/202307/package- ... n-oe.html

It may solve the partitions issue