Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Hello Fred:

Here are some thoughts on your i915 situation. Testing was done with the Daedalus Starter Kit.

I have a converted Chromebook with an AMD chipset, so it is not directly comparable to your machine. But it also has great trouble with any operation that involves restarting X, like changing screen mode via lxrandr. It locks up with a black screen of death that requires a hard reboot. Luckily, I saw your trick of making a small xorg.conf with the desired resolution, so I can now switch it successfully from 1920x1080 to 1280x720 at bootup. The Touchpad app has a new Mode tool that handles this.

I have another converted Chromebook with a Celeron N4000 chipset and Intel i915 UHD Graphics 600 video. It is closer to your machine but with a smaller 1366x768 screen. It is quite happy to change resolutions in lxrandr, even if the aspect ratio is different. Restarting X works every time.

I don't know why your machine behaves differently, but I no longer think that this situation is the crisis that it originally appeared to be. There are enough work-arounds that it doesn't require major changes.

fredx181 wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 6:11 pm

dancytron wrote: Fri May 26, 2023 5:12 pm

Matching the kernel to your hardware, especially if you use old/cheap consumer grade hardware, is just a part of using Linux sometimes.

I still use my old HP dual core desktop that won't run any kernel past Stretch.

Maybe just document in the 1st post how to use an older kernel if you have an issue.

But the discussion lately wasn't about older computers (well, my input) the problem you reported a while back, I thought, was on your very recent computer, not ?
My laptop? New? Yes! Cheap? Yes! Good? No! (had some other problems which I'm not going to bother you )

My laptop was apparently being sold new on closeout at Walmart 3 or 4 years ago, but the CPU/chipset is from 2016.

Debian Bookworm is now officially released: https://www.debian.org/News/2023/20230610

Here's modified mkilve-bookworm script mkilve-bookworm-nmu for to create a no-merged-usr (nmu) filesystem (like in the old days ).
edit: now added as choice, see: viewtopic.php?p=91725#p91725
Sometime ago (mentioned earlier in this thread) I thought that "usr-merge" cannot be avoided for bookworm, but now found a way by using the debootstrap from Devuan v1.0.128+nmu2devuan2 to create a base filesystem without merged-usr.

Only the base filesystem will be created as first step by using the Devuan debootstrap, for the rest of the build it will be pure Debian Bookworm (and e.g. still have choice to use systemd or not).

Personally I prefer this (no-merged-usr) for better backwards compatibility (e.g. using older custom made SFS's) , I'm thinking to make this the default for the mklive-bookworm build script.
(edit: or perhaps just offer it as a choice)
Anyone opinion ?

fredx181 wrote:

I'm thinking to make this the default for the mklive-bookworm build script

On second thought I think not, perhaps merged-usr will become essential in the future (i.e.. problems could arise with no-merged-usr).
At this time I've not found any problems with no-merged-usr though.
Noticed there's a file /etc/unsupported-skip-usrmerge-conversion (created by the Devuan debootstrap), it contains "this system will not be supported in the future".
Not sure how serious this is for Bookworm, probably it will be in the long term (post Bookworm ).

I wouldn't force the no-merge.

I think it's fine if no-merge is a choice but there should be an option to set it up as close to the standard "Debian Way" as possible (systemd, the file merge, and I guess still pulseaudio for now).

*** Updated Bookworm Build script ***

dancytron wrote:

I wouldn't force the no-merge.

Yes, not force, just added no-merged-usr as option now (checkbox, GUI only).
I expect that it will stay supported for Bookworm, but maybe not, we'll see.
New attached mklive-bookworm at first post.

I just built a DD Openbox with firefox that the display works correctly on my problem AMD/Radeon laptop.

I did it 64 bit systemd with

vlc pulseaudio blueman pavucontrol pulseaudio-module-bluetooth bluetooth firmware-amd-graphics firmware-iwlwifi firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-realtek libdrm-amdgpu1 xserver-xorg-input-libinput mc links2

extra files.

I'm not sure if I did something different (libdrm-amdgpu1 maybe) or if something got upgraded.

I've tried and failed, admittedly mostly from lack of attention span, but imho someone should to build a recipe for a Debian Dog Bookworm with pipewire systemd bluetooth etc., maybe using the same method as Bookworm puppy to deal with running as root.

dancytron wrote: Thu Aug 03, 2023 6:02 pm

I've tried and failed, admittedly mostly from lack of attention span, but imho someone should to build a recipe for a Debian Dog Bookworm with pipewire systemd bluetooth etc., maybe using the same method as Bookworm puppy to deal with running as root.

Figured out how it's done on Bookworm-Pup, where pipewire is running as spot, for Bookworm Dog: it requires modified /root/.xsession and /usr/local/bin/run-as-user (modified a bit from @jamesbond's latest run-as-spot)
Just for testing this setup, not sure yet about a "build recipe" , replace the above mentioned files with below attached and do apt install wireplumber pipewire-pulse pavucontrol (pulseaudio not needed).

EDIT: note that after downloading and removing fake .gz the file could become "xsession" (without the . at front) then you should make it .xsession .

The run-as-user script assumes the existence of user "puppy" in the system, change XUSER=... on top of script (and in ~/.xsession) for using another user.

Restart X after doing above and run pavucontrol to see if it worked out well.
I've tested on Bookworm with systemd running, but this way it doesn't use any systemd service to start pipewire.

I assume also leave out "pulseaudio-module-bluetooth"????

dancytron wrote: Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:23 pm

I assume also leave out "pulseaudio-module-bluetooth"????

Don't know anything about bluetooth TBH, but I see that on BookwormPup "pulseaudio-module-bluetooth' is not installed, so probably not needed .
But you may want to check for "libpipewire...modules" and or "libspa...bluetooth" (which are installed in BookwormPup)

I built one.

Sound works in mpv as root and run-as-user vlc as puppy.

Pipewire shows as the audio source.

Bluetooth doesn't work. It looks like it is going to work but fails at the very end.

I'm going to check permissions and groups. I think that's probably it.

I noticed that "bookworm-updates" and "proposed-updates" repos are enabled in the script. I commented them out.

Is that maybe left over from before it was stable??

dancytron wrote: Sun Aug 06, 2023 9:05 pm

I noticed that "bookworm-updates" and "proposed-updates" repos are enabled in the script. I commented them out.

Why ? Not giving any warning or error for me, so I see no reason to comment these out.

fredx181 wrote: Mon Aug 07, 2023 1:21 pm

dancytron wrote: Sun Aug 06, 2023 9:05 pm

I noticed that "bookworm-updates" and "proposed-updates" repos are enabled in the script. I commented them out.

Why ? Not giving any warning or error for me, so I see no reason to comment these out.

Maybe I don't understand what they are. It sounded like it was stuff that wasn't tested yet.

I'll put them back.

dancytron wrote: Mon Aug 07, 2023 1:59 pm

fredx181 wrote: Mon Aug 07, 2023 1:21 pm

dancytron wrote: Sun Aug 06, 2023 9:05 pm

I noticed that "bookworm-updates" and "proposed-updates" repos are enabled in the script. I commented them out.

Why ? Not giving any warning or error for me, so I see no reason to comment these out.

Maybe I don't understand what they are. It sounded like it was stuff that wasn't tested yet.

I'll put them back.

Well, it's a matter of choice to enable proposed-updates or not, on second thought it's not really needed, here's some info : https://wiki.debian.org/StableProposedUpdates
I remember from years ago (I think it was with 'squeeze') there was some faulty package that created a problem, enabling proposed-updates and updating that package fixed it.

Squeeze was a long time ago.

I've looked at that script 100 times and never noticed it until now.

Progress.

I decided to set an easier goal, to get pipewire and bluetooth running as puppy (normal system user) on a systemd pipewire install.

I built a bookworm Debian Dog with systemd enabled with the following additional files and the usual drivers to run on my computers.

slim   dbus-user-session pipewire blueman pavucontrol libspa-0.2-bluetooth wireplumber pipewire-pulse bluetooth vlc blueman libpipewire-0.3-0 
libpipewire-0.3-modules pipewire-alsa pipewire-jack pipewire-audio pipewire-doc vlc-plugin-pipewire

At the terminal window pause I added bluetooth and pipewire groups to the puppy ID and finished the script.

It bluetooth and pipewire both work correctly when logging in as puppy.

You'd think that dbus-user-session would be a dependency of something since you absolutely need it, but it isn't. I think that's a bug, but it's not our bug.

for reference Thread asking pipewire devs to let us run as root with the work around. https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/pipewire ... te_1852222

edit: The Bookworm puppy way with the substitute .xsession does not work at all now.

Changing "!=root" to "!=werewolf" in

/usr/lib/systemd/user/pipewire.service
/usr/lib/systemd/user/pipewire.socket
/usr/lib/systemd/user/pipewire-pulse.service
/usr/lib/systemd/user/pipewire-pulse.socket

did fix it and bluetooth and pipewire audio work correctly running as root after a reboot, but run-as-user script doesn't work.

That's obviously not the correct way to do it, but it's good enough to use a little bit and see if it's stable and for anybody who wants to reproduce it and maybe make the run-as-user script work.

edit: added the modded files so you can just paste them in. werewolf.zip

edit: When I paste the modded files into the chroot during the script, sound and bluetooth work on 1st boot.

edit: removed attachments. See new and improved in next post.

For reference:

These are the commands for wireplumber processes, but you shouldn't need them.

systemctl --user stop wireplumber.service pipewire.service pipewire.socket pipewire-pulse.service pipewire-pulse.socket
systemctl --user start wireplumber.service pipewire.service pipewire.socket pipewire-pulse.service pipewire-pulse.socket
systemctl --user restart wireplumber.service pipewire.service pipewire.socket pipewire-pulse.service pipewire-pulse.socket
systemctl --user enable wireplumber.service pipewire.service pipewire.socket pipewire-pulse.service pipewire-pulse.socket

Quick Start Instructions: Do a standard Debian Dog Frugal install. New version has all it needs on the .iso file.

Run-as-user doesn't work.

***********************************

I built a systemd/pipewire DD Bookworm in close to what I believe is the correct Debian way.

The reason it didn't "just work" is that it needed dbus-user-session, which isn't a dependency but seems like it should be.

Started with the minimal openbox Dog, unpinned openbox, deleted firefox, synaptic, a few other things, and added:

 slim dbus-user-session pipewire blueman pavucontrol libspa-0.2-bluetooth wireplumber pipewire-pulse bluetooth blueman libpipewire-0.3-0 libpipewire-0.3-modules pipewire-alsa pipewire-jack pipewire-audio pipewire-doc lxterminal 

and some of the essential DD utilities.

At the terminal window pause, I just added puppy to the bluetooth and pipewire groups.

After I booted, I modified the "!=root" systemd files in the officially Redhat approved, incredibly annoying, 1980's style text editor.* see https://makenotes.de/2021/03/override-systemd-unit-file

I used the full file method, which I think is fine.

systemctl --user --full edit pipewire.service 
systemctl --user --full edit pipewire.socket 
systemctl --user --full edit pipewire-pulse.service 
systemctl --user --full edit pipewire-pulse.socket

And then created an .squashfs file of my /changes directory after cleaning up all the other stuff using the built in DD utilities. (attached).

So, for it work as root, put 44-PWOverrideFilesForRoot.squashfs in the /live directotry at boot in addition to the stuff on the .iso.

Download ISO from Dropbox - 359 megabytes

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/pxzvvvo8 ... lvg22&dl=1

New version already has everything it needs. Just install like any other Debian dog.

Attached: 44-PWOverrideFilesForRoot.squashfs, log file and .conf file.

It seems to have autoconfigured jack too???

 md5sum /live/image/BookwormPWMinimal/8-28-23-PWire-minimal-DebLive_bookworm-amd64-UEFI.iso
45d30b0373c37c07921ab29f7bb4fd14 

This is the console error I get when I use run-as-user in firefox to play audio. Runs fine except audio.

XDG_RUNTIME_DIR (/run/user/0) is not owned by us (uid 1000), but by uid 0! (This could e.g. happen if you try to connect to a non-root PulseAudio as a root user, over the native protocol. Don't do that.)

this or the link inside it from Arch linux website may have the answer.

https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comm ... e_a_users/

edit: it does not have the answer

I was getting some crashes of openbox where the desktop icons would disappear and the right click menu would change. It seemed random.

I think unpinning openbox made it go away, but I can't be sure.

dancytron wrote: Mon Aug 28, 2023 7:55 pm

I was getting some crashes of openbox where the desktop icons would disappear and the right click menu would change. It seemed random.

I think unpinning openbox made it go away, but I can't be sure.

That is pcmanfm crashing, not openbox, as pcmanfm provides the desktop, happened to me also sometimes.

Some updates (for sid and daedalus too):

- Bugfix for when booting with porteus-boot option changes=EXIT:/... (save at shutdown or on demand) and when running save2flash during a session.
Usually I save a session only once (at shutdown) so didn't notice earlier.
What could happen is that when you run save2flash twice (e.g. in the middle of a session and by [SAVE] at shutdown or reboot) that deleted files or folders that exist by default (part of the rootfs sfs or other sfs loaded at boot) may fail to apply (unexpectedly back after reboot).
New "porteusbootscripts" package v1.1.7 in repositories with fix.

- Updated peasymp3 and new package xdialog3 (GTK3 build) from @rcrsn51, info:
viewtopic.php?p=97675#p97675

Thanks Ddog Team! I tried the script, the BookwormDog (JWM minimal, without firefox-esr) is very slick and responsive on my ancient core 2 duo desktop with 2g ram (copy to ram). My cpu have a AMD Hd8490 gpu card, so i added firmware-amd-graphics in order to enable X display.. Also need the firmware-misc-nonfree for my wireless adapter.

This BW dog only used around 200mb of ram when idle in desktop. Again, good job guys.

1. I plan to install this on pendrive and use this as a portable os on multiple PCs. What other firmware do i need to include to support majority decent hardware?

2. Currently my BW is still lacked of a dedicated Firewall.. But running as root i hope for recommendations or method to add the puppy default firewall into this os.

Be happy, be grateful

I think I figured out how to reproduce the pcmanfm desktop crash where the right click menu changes to what I assume is the lxde menu and the stuff on the desktop disappears.

Right click on a link to a .desktop file and try to open it in leafpad.

Unpinning Openbox doesn't fix it. Is that just for size or was there another reason?

lizardidi wrote: Sun Sep 10, 2023 6:19 am

Thanks Ddog Team! I tried the script, the BookwormDog (JWM minimal, without firefox-esr) is very slick and responsive on my ancient core 2 duo desktop with 2g ram (copy to ram). My cpu have a AMD Hd8490 gpu card, so i added firmware-amd-graphics in order to enable X display.. Also need the firmware-misc-nonfree for my wireless adapter.

This BW dog only used around 200mb of ram when idle in desktop. Again, good job guys.

1. I plan to install this on pendrive and use this as a portable os on multiple PCs. What other firmware do i need to include to support majority decent hardware?

2. Currently my BW is still lacked of a dedicated Firewall.. But running as root i hope for recommendations or method to add the puppy default firewall into this os.

Be happy, be grateful

There is a firewall in Fred's Repo. I don't personally use it. Try installing firewall-ng from synaptic and rebooting. It should autostart and have an icon on the system tray.

Running some sort of a host file helps too. Just add bad sites to /etc/hosts You can block out whole categories at a time by host name. Here is a list of lists of bad host names. Of course, one person's bad ip number is another person's entertainment. https://github.com/StevenBlack/hosts

Change the root and puppy passwords to something hard to guess.

fredx181 wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:39 pm

Some updates (for sid and daedalus too):

- Bugfix for when booting with porteus-boot option changes=EXIT:/... (save at shutdown or on demand) and when running save2flash during a session.
Usually I save a session only once (at shutdown) so didn't notice earlier.
What could happen is that when you run save2flash twice (e.g. in the middle of a session and by [SAVE] at shutdown or reboot) that deleted files or folders that exist by default (part of the rootfs sfs or other sfs loaded at boot) may fail to apply (unexpectedly back after reboot).
New "porteusbootscripts" package v1.1.7 in repositories with fix.

- Updated peasymp3 and new package xdialog3 (GTK3 build) from @rcrsn51, info:
https://forum.puppylinux.com/viewtopic. ... 675#p97675

Does the new save2flash upgrade apply to Buster too? Can I just install porteusbootscripts_1.1.7_all.deb in Buster?

dancytron wrote: Wed Sep 13, 2023 6:48 pm

fredx181 wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:39 pm

Some updates (for sid and daedalus too):

- Bugfix for when booting with porteus-boot option changes=EXIT:/... (save at shutdown or on demand) and when running save2flash during a session.
Usually I save a session only once (at shutdown) so didn't notice earlier.
What could happen is that when you run save2flash twice (e.g. in the middle of a session and by [SAVE] at shutdown or reboot) that deleted files or folders that exist by default (part of the rootfs sfs or other sfs loaded at boot) may fail to apply (unexpectedly back after reboot).
New "porteusbootscripts" package v1.1.7 in repositories with fix.

- Updated peasymp3 and new package xdialog3 (GTK3 build) from @rcrsn51, info:
https://forum.puppylinux.com/viewtopic. ... 675#p97675

Does the new save2flash upgrade apply to Buster too? Can I just install porteusbootscripts_1.1.7_all.deb in Buster?

No, BusterDog isn't using the same mechanism for save on demand, Bullseye and later run with "overlayfs" , Buster has "aufs".

What would be the best way to turn off the password for sudo for the puppy user id?