Problems booting F96-CE from USB sticks

[stevie pup]

I first tried F96-CE some time ago, (possibly version 1, can't remember now) and it failed miserably, couldn't get it to boot up. I see we're now on to version 4, so decided to give it another go. I prepared 3 USB sticks, one with Ventoy, one with YUMI, and one with Rufus. Still won't boot from the Ventoy stick, said it can't find .sfs file, but it did boot, eventually, from both of the others.

I say eventually because there was a ridiculous delay. In the early stages of the boot process it gets as far as "Booting kernel", then sits there with the flashing cursor on the line below, and sits there, and sits there. Once it does go to the next stage everything continues as normal, but this delay at booting kernel makes the total boot time 5 minutes. Not something I've ever experienced with any other Puppy. Any ideas and/or suggestions as to what the issue might be?

As a side note regarding the Ventoy USB, let's say I've got 10 iso's on a Ventoy stick, 3 Puppies and 7 other Linux distros. 9 of them boot up fine with no problems whatsoever, but the other one doesn't boot at all. This would suggest to me that the issue doesn't lie with either Ventoy or the USB stick itself, but with that particular iso?

Thanks

[amethyst]

I first tried F96-CE some time ago, (possibly version 1, can't remember now) and it failed miserably, couldn't get it to boot up. I see we're now on to version 4, so decided to give it another go. I prepared 3 USB sticks, one with Ventoy, one with YUMI, and one with Rufus. Still won't boot from the Ventoy stick, said it can't find .sfs file, but it did boot, eventually, from both of the others.

I say eventually because there was a ridiculous delay. In the early stages of the boot process it gets as far as "Booting kernel", then sits there with the flashing cursor on the line below, and sits there, and sits there. Once it does go to the next stage everything continues as normal, but this delay at booting kernel makes the total boot time 5 minutes. Not something I've ever experienced with any other Puppy. Any ideas and/or suggestions as to what the issue might be?

As a side note regarding the Ventoy USB, let's say I've got 10 iso's on a Ventoy stick, 3 Puppies and 7 other Linux distros. 9 of them boot up fine with no problems whatsoever, but the other one doesn't boot at all. This would suggest to me that the issue doesn't lie with either Ventoy or the USB stick itself, but with that particular iso?

Thanks

I have this booting delay when using most of the newer kernels on my old machines. I use the Tahr kernel with all my Puppys, older and newer.

[wizard]

@stevie pup

I had a problem with an old VT usb, updated to latest VT version and everything works (F96-CE_4)

wizard

[bigpup]

What is the computers specs?

[Clarity]

HIi @stevie pup

... As a side note regarding the Ventoy USB, ... but the other one doesn't boot at all. This would suggest ...

As @wizard shares, Ventoy continues to improve with newer releases.

I offer you this ( wont go into details as the beneficial reasons have been explained multiple places on the forum):

1. ENSURE your ISO files on the Ventoy USB are kept in a folder named "BOOTISOS". (Dont worry, Ventoy will find them on the USB)

2. Add SuperGrub2's (ISO or IMG) to the Ventoy USB

If you find a forum distro that does NOT boot directly from the Ventoy menu, as you explain above, then when booting your Ventoy for that distro, select booting SG2D; then select that distro from SG2D's list of the ISOs. You will find that it boots via the SG2D menu.

The knowledge that some forum distro struggle via Ventoy direct has been known to work for several years. Yet is also known, that all WoofCE PUPs, KLs and the DOGs on the forum all boot via SG2D. Yes, its awkward that some ISO boot directly while as well as all booting via SG2D, but as awkward as it is, it still works getting users to distro desktops and running with normal Frugal distro operations and session management.

As awkward as it seems in my description, I assure YOU that it is simple. Do the addition of SG2D once to your USB and forevermore boot all modern forum distros directly from their ISO files with no modifications. Truly a "download and boot" solution's for forum distros.

Hope this information is helpful.

P.S. There instructions are for Forum distros since 2019. I cannot attest to any non-forum or any forum distros prior to 2019.

[stevie pup]

@wizard @Clarity
Thank you for your comments. First off I downloaded the latest version of Ventoy and put the iso on that, still wouldn't boot. So next I added SG2D and created BOOTISOS folder. Started to boot then got stuck, can't remember at exactly what stage, but it wouldn't go any further. Can't help thinking there's something else going off here, and have abandoned Ventoy for the time being.

What is the computers specs?

Bit awkward that. Depending on what I'm doing and what's to hand I could be plugging the USB sticks into any one of 4 different machines, so specs vary.

Tried the USB created with Rufus again, and still has the long delay resulting in total boot time of 5 minutes, but with one exception. I don't get this delay if I plug USB into my little Netbook. Mind you, I didn't get any other options either, that is it doesn't display the first screen where you get a list of choices, it just went straight into booting. Where the Netbook differs is that it has UEFI, all my other laptops are Legacy BIOS only, could this be a hint as to where the issue lies? Bear in mind the Netbook is still almost 10 years old, so it's not that it's got some super modern processor.

As we're now getting to the time of year when I've got a multitude of other things to do rather than fiddling with PC's I may not be paying that much attention to it for the time being. I'm still running Fossa 9.5, along with a variety of other Linux distros, so I'm not in any great rush.

[wizard]

@stevie pup

Where the Netbook differs is that it has UEFI, all my other laptops are Legacy BIOS only, could this be a hint as to where the issue lies?

F96 ISO can make a hybrid boot USB, so that should not be an issue if you chose "Bios or UEFI" for Target system in Rufus. You should also select "MBR" for Partition scheme.

wizard

[Clarity]

Thanks @stevie pup for your update.

When your distro boot stopped, did it stop at a prompt. If so, would you type 'debug(tab)' to capture the logs. Post its folder on this thread for developer review.

... Can't help thinking there's something else going off here, and have abandoned Ventoy for the time being. ...

I can recreate your environment. My USB looks like this

Code: Select all

root# tree /mnt/sde1
/mnt/sde1
├── BOOTISOS
│   ├── KLV-Airedale-rc16.iso
│   └── supergrub2-classic-2.06s2-beta1-x86_64_efi-CD.iso
└── Ventoy_Here..txt

1 directory, 3 files

From your description, you have something akin to this. But, I need your help for an exact match.

1. What is the filesystem you have for partition #1 on your Ventoy USB?

2. Which of the following match your USB that you set up?

   VENTOY USB

   	SecureBoot	Non-secureboot
   GPT
   MSDOS

3. AND, just to be sure, which F96 version, as I have several that have been released.

I have seen your findings before on an early VanillaPUP64 booting from its ISO file, directly via Ventoy & SG2D.

[stevie pup]

F96 ISO can make a hybrid boot USB, so that should not be an issue if you chose "Bios or UEFI" for Target system in Rufus. You should also select "MBR" for Partition scheme.

wizard

Yep, did that. I've been using Rufus for a few years now and am fully familiar with it. I don't normally have any problems with Rufus USB's, in fact they often work when other methods don't. Unfortunately F96 appears to be the exception.

@Clarity I will try to produce the log you've asked for over the weekend.

I think I've mentioned this before elsewhere, but I only seem to have issues with modern Pups. I wanted to try one of the KLV iso's a short while ago, lots of headaches with that as well. Eventually got it to boot but it took about 15 attempts. So I can't help thinking there's something different in modern Pups.

Never, ever had any of these issues with Bionic, Stretch, etc. I always said Bionic32 must have a magic ingredient, didn't matter what method I used to create the USB, or what machine I plugged it into, Bionic32 ALWAYS booted without issue. Oh those were the days.

[Clarity]

Hi @stevie pup

You might want to skip my instructions for a log as it appears on my end, I am having problems as you are reporting. I have same problem booting the USBs (both Ventoy's USB and SG2D USB) running into the boot problems. In this case that I am witnessing, the failure does NOT dump you to a prompt where you can enter the debug command to capture a folder of logs...instead it merely progresses to a trap-abend requiring a hard-restart.

I have raise an appeal and let's hope development can respond.

My test PCs are old 2009-2014 Intels from varied manufacturers with wildly different POST starts for BIOS/UEFI. But the results are the same.

Next step is to backtrack thru old releases to see if I can identify where this boot issue began.

Soon, I hope.

[stevie pup]

Thank you for that @Clarity, I will hang fire and see what develops. I didn't think it went to a prompt but wasn't 100% sure, so was going to give it another go. The older I get the more fuzzy my memory becomes.

[norgo]

Hi @stevie pup

You might want to skip my instructions for a log as it appears on my end, I am having problems as you are reporting. I have same problem booting the USBs (both Ventoy's USB and SG2D USB) running into the boot problems. In this case that I am witnessing, the failure does NOT dump you to a prompt where you can enter the debug command to capture a folder of logs...instead it merely progresses to a trap-abend requiring a hard-restart.

I have raise an appeal and let's hope development can respond.

My test PCs are old 2009-2014 Intels from varied manufacturers with wildly different POST starts for BIOS/UEFI. But the results are the same.

Next step is to backtrack thru old releases to see if I can identify where this boot issue began.

Soon, I hope.

Maybe this could be a reason ?
I've no idea what module.
There is no error message or hint in the log file.
This happens directly before aborting boot process.

Screenshot.jpg (68.83 KiB) Viewed 1413 times

[stevie pup]

An update on this booting saga. I decided to try a different approach, so I used a spare portable HD, created a folder and copied all the contents of the iso file into it. I then ran Grup4Dos.

Now boots up fine, no problems. No claims it couldn't find something, no excessive time delay in the boot procedure, all went smoothly.

So for some reason it just doesn't like booting the iso from USB's. I'll leave someone else to figure that out, I can carry on using this portable HD.

Next on the agenda is to change the appearance. Sorry but don't like the various shades of grey one bit.

[charlie6]

Hi all,
Many, many thanks rockedge for this nice FC-96. I made it my daily puppy for all uses (sorry for my bad english).
Bringing my cent to this issue, this possibly workaround works for me since now quite one year.
I now have putted it into a remastered iso so that it boots at first start.
Here is the link to a post explaining that workaround - i.e. editing the file /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-intel.conf - as detailed hereunder
(I believe I posted it on a wrong thread place at that time, sorry ! )

viewtopic.php?p=105292#p105292

new file /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-intel.conf

Code: Select all

Section "Device"  
   Identifier  "Intel Graphics"
   Driver      "intel"
   Option      "AccelMethod"     "uxa"
EndSection

Hope this helps.
Best regards from Belgium
Charlie