It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

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benali72
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It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by benali72 »

I've been using Puppy, off and on, very happily since version 2. This note is not intended as a criticism but rather as a positive recommendation for the future.

What I see happening is this ...

Back when I started with Puppy, it was very challenging to run a good solid linux distro on a 5 to 15 year old computer. Puppy elegantly solved this problem for the world. It revitalized the old computers of the day.

The trade-off was that the desktop GUI (JWM/Rox/etc) was somewhat more primitive than today's more popular mainstream interfaces (Xfce, Mate, Lxqt/Lxde, etc). With JWM/Rox, it's more difficult to alter the taskbar, change the desktop icons, perform common file operations without copy/paste, etc.

That was necessary and good because you simply couldn't run a more capable desktop GUI on older equipment... it required too many resources.

But today that is no longer the case. You can easily run those more sophisticated interfaces like Xfce, Mate, Lxqt, etc on an older computer without noticeable loss of performance.

For example, I dual-boot Puppy and Mint/Xfce on all my machines and those I give away to charity -- which are 8 to 12 year old Intel Dual Core boxes with 2 to 4 gig ram. I see everyone choosing to use the Mint/Xfce install these days because the desktop GUI is easier -- you can easily alter the taskbar, change the desktop icons, copy/paste for file operations, and more.

So here's my point. The more resource-light JWM/Rox interface is no longer necessary. If Puppy had a more capable desktop GUI -- like Xfce or Lxqt -- it would be much popular. The public now expects that easier desktop GUI. And Puppy would not lose any performance capability in terms of the 5 to 15 year old computers that are the sweet spot of its user base.

It's 2021, and old computers have grown up. I'd recommend a Puppy with Xfce or Lxqt interface. It would continue to achieve Puppy's goals -- while making it much more popular.

(thanks for listening, and sorry if this is posted in the wrong place...)

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by peebee »

Builder of LxPups, SPups, UPup32s, VoidPups; LXDE, LXQt, Xfce addons; Chromium, Firefox etc. sfs; & Kernels

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by mikeslr »

Ditto what peebee wrote. But also get to know how to use radky's Menu>Desktop>JWMDesk. It's built-into most new Puppys, but can also be installed from here, viewtopic.php?t=3561. It provides a GUI which makes it easy to "alter the taskbar, change the desktop icons".

JWMDesk GUI.png
JWMDesk GUI.png (66.3 KiB) Viewed 551 times

The "options" Tab enables you to create and place a 2nd panel.
Clicking the Puppy Setup Tab at the bottom will bring up this additional GUI.

JWMDesk's Puppy Setup.png
JWMDesk's Puppy Setup.png (52.72 KiB) Viewed 548 times

. The GUI which opens from its Menu Manager Tab provides a toggle to turn off the Menu display of applications you never use. Or on, if you change your mind.
If you're unsatisfied with how rox manages files, double check what's now available on the Filesystem thread. You'll find a post revealing some tricks I wasn't aware of, viewtopic.php?p=39552#p39552, and discussions about dual/multi-pane file-managers such as xfe and pcmanfm. Both are simple installs via PPM.

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by JASpup »

Op reads enough like me that I had to guess if he was an authentic account: viewtopic.php?p=8763#p8763

I have a few posts like the one above.

The issue is less user agreement than motivated creators standardizing alt-DEs, meaning putting them out as official Puppy releases and not considering them puplets. The X-series from as far back as Precise is good enough. When computers were slower JWM chauvinism made sense. Now it's more like falling behind.

Look at peebea's gorgeous concoctions:
Image
LXQt
Image
XFCE

These are ydrv meaning no one without above-average intelligence specifically looking for them or a coder is going to intentionally use them. With X-series customizations they could be over-the-top.

Really from a user standpoint it's about the time invested in customization and usability, which finds me doing things like 32 Tahr JWM at the moment. Why? I spent so much time on it I made it look good and hum along in a predictable way.

I booted 64 Fossa yesterday and was saying to myself, "What the heck is happening to my desktop? How does the archive open now?" (Granted 32 has updated inventions too like single-partition pmount running when you hotplug.) I ought stick to Xenial.

Xenial 64 mentioned in previous post links:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/xenialpup64-with-xfce/

more recent 64 XFCE:
(Hippo-era Slackware?)
viewtopic.php?t=3171

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benali72
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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by benali72 »

Thank you all for the good feedback and helpful links.

If anyone could provide me a link to an ISO file for an XFCE or LXQt Puppy that is the most ready for prime time, I'd love to run that Puppy as my every day Linux, and provide testing feedback on it.

It doesn't matter whether the ISO is an XFCE or LXQt Puppy, as long as it boots on my old BIOS computers.

(I don't have UEFI... I tried QuickPup64_21.08-BETA-13 a while back, and it wouldn't boot for me, am I correct in assuming it's for UEFI computers?)

If we don't have an ISO file ready, but rather some combination of sfs or ydrv or whatever, unfortunately I'm not fluent in those technologies. So I'd be glad to work with it, but I would need specific step-by-step instructions on how to set up or install (my apologies).

If I may I add an opinion.... JASpup is exactly right. From a marketing standpoint, an XFCE or LXQt Puppy on the official distribution list would really boost Puppy's popularity.

Puppy has so many strong tools and such great advantages. But the average user is often put off by an interface that is quirky compared to what they're used to. I install and configure charity computers, and the people who used to accept Puppy a decade ago no longer do because the user interface no longer meets their expectations.

Thanks again everyone for the feedback.

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by one »

benali72 wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 4:33 am

[...]
If anyone could provide me a link to an ISO file for an XFCE or LXQt Puppy that is the most ready for prime time, I'd love to run that Puppy as my every day Linux, and provide testing feedback on it.

It doesn't matter whether the ISO is an XFCE or LXQt Puppy, as long as it boots on my old BIOS computers.

(I don't have UEFI... I tried QuickPup64_21.08-BETA-13 a while back, and it wouldn't boot for me, am I correct in assuming it's for UEFI computers?)
[...]

I run quickpup64_21.08 BETA 13 (XFCE) on a 10 years old acer laptop with old BIOS - so your assumption is not correct!
Post in @mistfire 's thread if you need help:

viewtopic.php?t=3171

peace

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by JASpup »

benali72 wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 4:33 am

If anyone could provide me a link to an ISO file for an XFCE or LXQt Puppy that is the most ready for prime time, I'd love to run that Puppy as my every day Linux, and provide testing feedback on it.

32-bit Hirsute Hippo: http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/pu ... -21.04.htm

Download/install the base .iso

At the bottom, see the ydrv, and choose the one you want. If you put it in the same directory as Puppy, the desktop environment of the ydrv will boot.

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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by peebee »

You must do a frugal install - the recommended install method for Puppy - in order to use a ydrv....

Builder of LxPups, SPups, UPup32s, VoidPups; LXDE, LXQt, Xfce addons; Chromium, Firefox etc. sfs; & Kernels

benali72
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Re: It's Time for an Xfce or Lxqt Puppy

Post by benali72 »

So with the good advice here, I was able to install 2 xfce puppies for testing --

32-bit Hirsute Hippo (UPupHH+D-21.04+7.iso plus ydrv_upuphh+d_21.04.sfs)
and
Xenial 64 Pup with Xfce (xfcexenial-R5[fixed].iso)

Though I tried multiple downloads w/ checksums, different boot image writers, and two different computers, I was never able to get QuickPup 64 (quickpup64_21.08-beta-13.iso) to boot. I either got an error in writing the boot image to USB, or it gave me a Boot Error when trying to boot it. Maybe I was too tired and overlooking something but after a couple hours I gave up on it.

Thanks everyone.

Finally... is there ever a chance that an Xfce Puppy will make the official download list? Or will they just remain in the forums? Thanks.

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