I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by mikeslr »

Hi suniram,

Yes. Unfortunately, Microsoft has placed a stumbling block just where people would take their first step to get from 'there' to 'here'. It has the name 'UEFI'. It was touted as 'for reasons of security'. But, circumvented by even 'white hats' in fifteen minutes and now present on all newly manufactured PCs, it actually makes it easier to maliciously effect computers. It's real raison d'etre was Microsoft's move from a life-time licensing model to a pro temp renting model.
We've had a couple of years to figure out ways to jump over the stumbling block. They are now spelled out in 'The Instructional How To >Boot' Section, viewforum.php?f=155 with --the English language being somewhat lax in confining the meaning of terms-- spill-over into the 'How to > Install' Section, viewforum.php?f=156.

That said use of rufus under Windows is almost flawless [at least where your target is Bionicpup64 booted from a USB-Key. I don't recall anyone posting a problem about that. But do recall a problem with Fossapup64. Another reason I recommend Bionicpup64 for 'newbies'.] You'll find rufus here, both installable and (if you prefer) portable. https://rufus.ie/en_US/ Running, rufus will install Puppy to a USB-key, do the necessary formatting, and install a bootloader. You really don't have to do anything other than download a Puppy ISO, download and run rufus, plug in a USB-Key and point rufus to the ISO and the Key.
Running a rufus-installed Puppy is not the best way. The USB-Key will have been formatted as Fat32. That will impose some constraints such as having to use a SaveFile rather than a SaveFolder to preserve settings, customizations and installed applications. A SaveFolder --requires a Linux Formatted partition-- will expand to the entire available space on a partition as and when you make use of it. The size of a SaveFile has to be specified on first shut-down. There's an application to grow but not shrink a SaveFile. If you don't intend to use portable-wine, you would need a SaveFile large enough to hold a lot of information. I think 4 Gbs minimum..
But, I wouldn't do that. I'd recommend just using rufus to get your first Puppy running. Into that Puppy I would install the frugalpup application available here, viewtopic.php?p=1588#p1588. With the frugalpup application, and the gparted built into all Puppys, you can easily (a) format hard-drive partitions as Linux Ext3 or 4 [after using Window's programs to create 'Unallocated' space]; (b) format USB-Keys in whatever way you want; and (c) produce boot-loaders which will handle any Puppy (including FossaPup64) and Windows.

However, if you run into any problems or have further questions about booting, please start a new thread after reading bigpup's post. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=218

"I still wish somebody had answered me re Blender speed on Puppy" vis-a-vis Windows. I don't know as I haven't run Blender under Windows. But, I can tell you this about Puppy's speed: Reading files into RAM from a USB-Key, version 2, is 10 to 15 times slower than from a sata hard-drive. I can boot Bionicpup64 from a USB-Key, have it automatically load Mike Walsh's Chrooted Iron 89 SFS, viewtopic.php?f=90&t=760 --which requires copying a 2nd operating system into RAM-- have wifi up-and-running and be ready to access the internet faster than Windows 7 on the same computer's hard-drive can present a functioning desktop. Once in RAM, everything works at the speed of RAM; not the speed of transmission from Storage to RAM. YEMV, especially with respect to the extent of your computer's RAM.

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by oui »

suniram
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I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by suniram » Fri May 28, 2021 4:30 am

Why are computers like hemorrhoids? When you sit down the pain returns.

try a daily smoothly massage using 1/2 cm hamamelis creme: you will soon forget your hemorrhoids and pains :welcome:

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Infinice in Vancouver
W7 64bit user, i5-3570K cpu (with its HD4000 IGP), 8Gb RAM).

for those pains is https://sourceforge.net/projects/dpup/f ... o/download a good solution :idea:

and add stuff from https://sourceforge.net/projects/dpup/files/64bit/

espacially https://sourceforge.net/projects/dpup/f ... s/download because of the compatibility with the user files created with the terrible M$ software

(I use the 32 bit version of it since months, as I will contribute to preserve 32 bit systems for other! the OS in 32 bit from josep2424 is good for me because I don't need to take in consideration the files created on software from M$ :mrgreen: . pls abandon in future those software and use an open software :roll: ! remark: josep2424 offers also https://sourceforge.net/projects/dpup/f ... s/download !).

as you seem to be new in Linux, I find that the xfce4 version is optimal for you as it can be found probably in all really actual linux distributions :thumbup2:

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by Wiz57 »

Has anyone mentioned using Lick to install a Puppy to a Windows 7 machine? If not, then I will...
might as well try this, as it will setup the boot entry, backup the Windows boot files, etc.
Wiz

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by suniram »

Hi-
I tried to identify which, UEFI or BIOS, but couldn't, because the online tutorials showed result images ("you do this, and you'll see that form") that diverged from mine. (Situation not helped by fact that most such tutorials only for Windows 10 users.).
I used Etcher to Puppy-ize my USB stick. It once had a few windows files on it, but was blank when i used it.
Suniram

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by williwaw »

Etcher may not be your best choice for puppy. try one of the ones suggested above.

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by suniram »

But i have W7, not 8 or 10- and BIOS Mode does not appear in list to right.
Etcher "may" not be best for Puppy? That sounds like a guess. Still, nothing lost by trying another, true.
Thanks for trying to help!

Suniram

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by williwaw »

BIOS Mode does not appear in list to right.

fair enough,

Did you say what make model of machine you have?
There is usually a f key to press at boot time that brings up the boot menu or bio set up. If ufei is in your bios there will be indications on the boot area..

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2525

which puppy are you trying to install?

getting just about any puppy booted will give you linux tools to make exploring other pups much easier

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by suniram »

A postscript-
Here we go again. So i tried Rufus, and redownloaded Puppy iso. Rufus insisted i format USB key... so ok, i did. Or tried. Errors errors errors.
Another usb key bites the dust- this is the third usb key Linux has trashed. I'll buy one more and then, as W. C. Fields once said, "Try try try! But if it just doesn't work, give up! No use being a damn fool about it.".

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by williwaw »

Can you be more specific about which puppy you are trying to install with rufus?

I am not sure there is anything wrong with your usb sticks that cannot be fixed

if you are going to report errors, please tell what happens up to the point you see errors, and describe the errors in more detail. I know getting the first pup to boot can be frustrating, but more specific info about your setup and whats happening will allow others to help you better.

can you burn a cd with your equipment?

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by bigpup »

Rufus insisted i format USB key... so ok, i did. Or tried. Errors errors errors.
Another usb key bites the dust- this is the third usb key Linux has trashed.

so, you do not know how to use the programs in Window 7 to format a partition on a USB flash drive.
There is nothing wrong with the drives except you need to properly partition and format them.

A New USB flash drive usually comes partitioned as one partition and formatted fat32.
That is what Rufus is probably wanting to see.
One partition formatted fat 32.

For Windows

WARNING: Formatting the USB device will delete all content on the device.
For Windows Operating Systems

Make Sure You Select the USB drive

Connect the USB storage device to the computer.
Open the Computer or This PC window, depending on your OS version:
Windows Vista and 7:
Click Start
Click Computer
In the Computer or This PC window, right-click the drive icon in which the USB device appears.
From the menu, click Format.
In the Format device name (drive letter) window, under File system, click the drop-down arrow, select
FAT32.
At the WARNING… message, click OK to continue.
At the Format Complete message, click OK.
At the Format device name (drive letter) window, click Close.
In the top-right corner of the Computer or This PC window, click the X to close the window.
Eject the device before removing the USB stick.

If the USB drive has more than one partition.
The disk management program can be used to delete/make partitions and format.
Make very sure you are selecting the USB drive to change.

To start Disk Management:

Log on as administrator or as a member of the Administrators group.

Click Start -> Run -> type compmgmt. msc -> click OK. Alternatively, right-click on the My Computer icon and select 'Manage'.

In the console tree, click Disk Management. The Disk Management window appears

.

After getting Puppy installed on the USB drive.

Computers with UEFI bios are setup to normally require turning off secure boot, enable legacy boot, or enable CSM to be able to boot from Puppy Linux on a USB.
Puppy Linux does not have a security key in the Puppy ISO, so secure boot needs disabled or turned off.
Some UEFI bios will not see a USB as a bootable device unless it is in legacy boot mode or enable CSM mode.
Computer will have some key to press to access it's UEFI setup.
In the setup should find these settings.
Depends on the version of UEFI as to what settings it has.
But all should offer to turn off/disable secure boot. (legacy boot mode and CSM mode disable secure boot automatically)

The UEFI setup will also have setting to change the boot device order.
Change this to the USB drive as first device to boot from.

You can also do this to change boot device.
Usually just as computer starts, you can press a specific key to bring up a list of bootable devices. (F7, F11, ESC, F9) your computer should provide info on this in it's manual.
Select the USB drive from this list.

The things you do not tell us, are usually the clue to fixing the problem.
When I was a kid, I wanted to be older.
This is not what I expected :o

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by bigpup »

One possible issue with Windows and how you shut it down.
Do not shutdown windows in hibernate.
Shutdown normally, to completely shutdown the computer.
Hibernate puts the computer boot process in Windows controlled configuration.

The things you do not tell us, are usually the clue to fixing the problem.
When I was a kid, I wanted to be older.
This is not what I expected :o

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by oui »

https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/creating- ... ian-linux/ is an excellent methode: you do all in commando line (*1 and can understand what really happen! shut before that your computer completely and restart with your puppy burn on an CD (attention: burn it using the special mode «for ISO files!)... what an be more simple :idea: !

(*1 all commando line commands are detailed on the web! consult "manpage dd" for example, or manpage df or manpage ls and find so the options for each command (for ex. ls -l! Just try it now if you are in linux now! the manpages are not always present in Puppy to make it tiny. for this reason, you have to browse the web. if you do that frequently, you will be soon a real linux expert and answer in that forum the questions of newbies :mrgreen: . you can make all (excepted real graphic apps) in commando line! The TERMINAL emulator is your best friend :roll:

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by one »

oui wrote: Wed Jun 02, 2021 8:26 am

https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/creating- ... ian-linux/ is an excellent methode: you do all in commando line (*1 and can understand what really happen! shut before that your computer completely and restart with your puppy burn on an CD (attention: burn it using the special mode «for ISO files!)... what an be more simple :idea: !
[...]

The link you provided uses the "dd"-command. So be prepared to end with a read-only ISO 9660 device!

Since you are on win7 I suggest this:

viewtopic.php?f=155&t=3097 (thank @Jafadmin)

Good luck

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by stevie pup »

In order that suniram (and anyone else who's interested) can restore all those USB sticks to "as new", here is the method I use in Windows 7. I have cleaned literally dozens of USB sticks, and this is the only method I've found that has been absolutely 100% successful in every case. It may well look a bit long winded at first, but it's better than continually buying new USB sticks, and now I'm used to it I can do one in just a few minutes.

When you come to make entries in the system, ignore the quotation marks. So plug in one of those USB sticks, and here we go:

Stage 1

1. Click on start button in bottom left hand corner, click “all programmes” then click on “Accessories”

2. Right click on “Command prompt” then click on “Run as administrator”. You will get a box pop up asking if you want to allow changes, click yes

3. In the black box that comes up next type “diskpart” then hit enter

4. At this point you may get another black box come up. In this type “list disk” then hit enter

5. What will be displayed next will look something like this:
Disk 0 Online 232GB
Disk 1 Online 7377MB

It is obvious from this that Disk 0 is the hard drive and Disk 1 is the USB stick, simply by the size of each. Probably best if you don't have anything else plugged in so as not to confuse things.

6. Make absolutely sure you've correctly identified your USB stick. IF YOU PICK THE WRONG ONE YOU RISK WRECKING YOUR HARD DRIVE.

7. So in the example above we've identified the USB stick as Disk 1, so we type “select disk 1” and hit enter. If yours is Disk 2, you would enter "select disk 2", and so on

8. You will get a message to say Disk 1/2/etc is the selected disk. Make sure it's the right one then type “clean” and hit enter

9. At this point you should get a message stating DiskPart succeeded in cleaning the disk. If you do, all well and good, but sometimes you will get a message to say there's been a problem: Access denied. If you do, don't panic, simply type “clean” again and hit enter

In all the cases I've done any that have failed at the first attempt have all succeeded at the second attempt. I'm afraid I have no idea why some take two attempts

10. You can now close the CMD window but leave the USB stick where it is

Stage 2

11. Go to Control Panel - System and Security - Administrative Tools

12. Double click on “Computer Management” then click on “Disk Management”

13. You will now see the various drives on the PC. The USB stick will be in black/grey and say “unallocated”. Right click in this area and select “New Simple Volume”

14. Click next on each following page (it's normally ok to leave defaults) then OK and Finish

You should now have a USB stick that is back to it's original capacity and basically as new.

Just out of curiosity suniram, you said in your original post that your Win7 is soon to become obsolete, why is that?

Thanks

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by suniram »

Yup-
You got my number. I'm a dummy, a lazy idiot! But i give credit where it's due- you guys, while you may be cheerleading something that appeals only to masochists and/or lovers of tinkering (as opposed to tool-users), you *are* helpful. And that ain't hay. I wish the other forums i've had to deal with had guys like you.
If not for you i wouldn't have gotten the short distance i managed. Thank you! Really.
An ironic postscript. I had a brief power outage. When it resumed my craputer, er computer, booted into Puppy! I didn't know whether to laugh, cry, or sh*t.
Anyway, i found Puppy a nightmare. When you can't even decipher what its menus and icons refer to... well.
The worst part was the mouse controller. I found mousing very slow, weak/lethargic, like dragging a 20 pd weight across the floor. I tried to accelerate it, using different settings it had no effect.
I apologize for wasting your (plural) time. But it's time to cut my, and your, losses.
Bye

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Re: I guess my first question is, which kind of Puppy should i try to adopt?

Post by rockedge »

@suniram had you pegged from the start, I told you in your situation to stick with Microsoft and Apple products. You being a power user of major tool sets already know where to go. What you want to do is put people down disguised by a smile. You made your point already in the first posts and said good bye and good riddance......so what is it this time?

You want convenience and conformity you well know where to get it. You have repeated that you are lazy and prefer someone else does the heavy lifting so you can power use all those tools.

So go for it and Good Luck!

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