Kernels and chromebooks, Oh MY!

[clm1919]

@clm1919 - in my grub .cfg, I add rootwait to linux line for slow detection machines. Might help.

@ozsouth When i finally decide I'm confident/knowledgeable enough to be editing the Grub .cfg I will DEFINETLY look into this - TY TY!

[mouldy]

@wizard
@mouldy
apologies for the miss-quote earlier. My head was just swimming from the cryptic information that was over my head, got confused

------------------------------------------------------
@mikewalsh

Glad to see you getting some love from your SD card slot. Love these stories.

I tried wizard's advice (actual quote here- FRFR)

You might try installing both grub and Puppy on the fat32 partition to see if that will boot

and indeed it DID boot (on the 2nd microSD card), but i still had to pop it in-and-out during the "waiting for partition" window.

I decided to take a picture of what happens when i DON'T pop it in and out.

20Q.jpeg

and yeah....I have no idea what 90% of that means.

Note this is from the "put it all on the FAT32" card.
Haven't taken a picture of when the FAT32/EXT4 card "fails" because i don't pop it in-and-out.

If you think any of this has any worth i could record the boot with my phone or something, but honestly (for ME) it's "good enough for now" that it works with they way it does. UNLESS this is something that could prevent the ultimate goal of upgrading the kernel so i can get the sound working under puppy

(never LOOSE sight of the goal.....but digressions on the path to true enlightenment are part of the journey)
- probably paraphrasing somebody.....so I'll just say "not mine"

Yea, that "Waiting 60 seconds" "finding main SFS file" FAILED looks very familiar. I thought one of my cards was full size SD card, but turns out both are micro SD in an adapter. So adds more complexity and points of possible failure. If I were interested enough should swap adapter and try the card that failed in the other adapter. Might work. Like mention, SD cards and card readers require bit luck. I wouldnt doubt it might be a contact issue on yours pulling out and reinserting the card. I have had old computers that regularly required me to reseat the RAM to get them to boot. Just saying.

And yea I suspect those high end SD cards be more usable for this sort thing. But they are crazy priced. Great if you have camera or phone or something that only uses SD card and needs super fast and reliable. And have extra electrical contacts so probably need special card reader to support those extra contacts. Think they are backwards compatible but you lose that extra "speed" if used in older card reader. Like I mentioned in my thread on booting from built in SD reader, you can buy a used NVMe SSD (or SATA M.2 SSD) for same price. Lot better performance and tend to last lot longer. NVMe SSDs are narrow and the 2230 ones even pretty short, about size of M.2 wifi card maybe just wee bit longer. I have found used 256GB ones on ebay for less than $15. Think you can get new noname one on Amazon for not much more. Personally rather have a branded used SSD over a noname new one, but thats me. Course you then tend to need an adapter unless you get lucky and your laptop has a socket for such inside. Some do. Make sure whether its NVMe or SATA M.2 Some sockets wired to use either apparently, though I havent run across one. Order from China and can get the adapters to put NVMe in M.2 wifi slot for cheap as $2.50. Lot of the USB adapters for NVMe tend to use cables for some unknown reason. I mean nobody wants a pocket full of cables... The one I liked that was short (only supported the 2230 version NVMe) and came either usb-A or usb-c solidly mounted like a thumbdrive and was more like $20, but it was aluminum. It just looked like a kinda chubby thumb drive. Magnetic cap and wouldnt be problem to put in your pocket like a thumb drive.

Still amazing as much as they try to sell even cheapest laptop for, why cheap out with these slow stupid (and small capacity) eMMC drives. Obviously M.2 NVMe or SATA ssd is NOT expensive. If you really have to as manufacturer of low end laptop, put in an extra small capacity SSD but at least buyer can upgrade. Guess it means they get suckers to buy them, find out they cant upgrade anything so then buy another new laptop further up the food chain. Its obvious lot people buy on price without doing their homework on the specs, then feel locked into windows only cause thats what it came with. The crapbooks are fine at $100 if you really truly dont want to deal with used, but they are trying to get $200 to $300 out of them now with very little improvement over the older $100 ones. Then you get it home and have to deal with the big PITA that is windows and it insisting you have the full (and extra profitable) windows experience whether you want that or not. They are only now forced to improve new crapbooks to handle win11.

[wizard]

@clm1919

people often get "new" and "improved" confused - there's something to be said for "it just works"

Ain't it so.

wizard

[clm1919]

@mouldy -thanks for that post on m.2 cards, SD cards and storage. I agree and found it informative.

The cromebook DOES have a wifi card - but being a bit of a luddite i prefer to use a USB/Ethernet adapter (hence my desire to use the micro-SD card slot - chromebooks aren't famed for the number of ports they come with)

I had only done a TINY bit of research on what might be possible re: swapping the wifi for a storage card.

BUT, unless I can get sound working under puppy it's kind of "moot-for-now". also- it's crammed in there, only space for the teeny-tiny cards. Still, an exciting option for down-the-road in the project.

long day for me today - so attempting kernel stuff will have to wait till tomorrow. But the TLDR as of right now is:

-The Deb12 install works w/ sound - BUT....I really want to make this work under Puppy. (invested/stubborn now)

@wizard
@bigpup
@mikewalsh
@mikeslr
@ozsouth

PUPPY STATUS - BookwormPup64_10.0.7
-1 micro-sd card (partitioned FAT32/EXT4) -
-1 micro-sd card (only FAT32)

both boot the machine, but have to be popped in and out - I'm fine with that @ this stage.

everything (except sound) seems to work.

i suppose i should mention my "end goal" is to be able to make a puppy SD card that could be popped in to a "mrchrombox-updated-firmware" chromebook so it could boot it's ChromeOS but have the option of using puppylinux. So many of my students are struggling w/ the crappy chromebooks their schools give them. (yes, i realize some of them are firmware locked, but I find it surprising how many are NOT).

QUESTIONS/Next Steps
-So i think the next step to to "pick a kernel" and make a second attempt. (ANY ADVICE here is VERY VERY welcome)

-Do you guys think it matters which SD card I test it out on? Maybe i should format them both FAT32/Ext4?

-assuming a 6.6.x puppy kernel does boot the machine - my plan is to try the "magic-audio-script" by WeirdTreeThing to install the required firmware/drivers.

-OR maybe i should try to use the driver/firmware stuff i found on intel's website?

*****should i re-link these things if they exist earlier in the thread? I don't want to constantly spam stuff i've already posted - yet it seems like it would be useful to condense stuff and not make it harder for someone to have go and find it, even if it makes the posts longer - Whats the etiquette?****

[mouldy]

Honestly I am surprised BookwormPup64 doesnt have sound if Debian 12 does. But who knows. I have one converted chromebook that has sound with with BookwormPup64 but not with BookwormDog. And they honestly should be very similar. Debian 12 on it does have sound too. But its low end so pretty much Puppy or Dog. I did get micro11 booted on it, but no sound on it as no win11 driver. Micro11 and Mint both still too bloated. Puppy and Dog running off NVMe can actually stream youtube video. NVMe is lot faster than eMMC and definitely faster than SD card. Its pretty choppy with anything else.

It just takes patience to open these up. Usually bunch screws, some hidden. Then some hidden plastic catches that come apart when gently pried, well sometimes not so gently, just make sure its the catch and not a hidden screw you missed. Try to find a video of one like yours opened so you know what to expect. Some of these its simple with a $2 adapter and NVMe card. Others they dont leave you enough room so you need a much more expensive adapter with a ribbon cable that can let you mount the card where there is room. The nice thing mrchromebox UEFI bios does support NVMe so you dont have to do refind or split install workaround. Also suggest while you have it open, put new thermal paste between processor and the heat spreader or heat sink.

Luckily several youtube videos of replacing wifi card with ssd. Some older ones had mpcie wifi card, these of course take different adapter and probably on those better luck with a SATA than NVMe. Though adapter for both. there is a mpcie to msata on way, but stuff on the slow boat from china, never know if you will get it or when. I really want to try it on old Dell D430 I have. Very old with legacy only bios so be interesting. The mpcie to NVMe adapter didnt work on it.

[clm1919]

@mouldy - thanks for your input!

Deb12 didn't work "out of the box" either. But WeirdTreeThing on GitHub has a script that does 2 things (that i am aware of)

a) it installs a "chultrabook kernel" (but at last check this part of the script was broken - so it had to be manually upgraded"

b) it would install one of two firmware updates - I linked part of the script that seemed (maybe) relevant (to me) in an earlier post. - but i confess i really don't understand it.

So the challenge for me is how to replicate the process. Everything i seem to read say's there's something in kernel versions higher than 6.4 that allow the firmware/drivers to work. But does it need tweaking for a chromebook? Will it work under puppy? can any 6.4+ kernel work? I'm am TOTALLY unqualified and ignorant in these arenas.

Off to work now. I'll try to check in when i get home later tonight (EST).

[mouldy]

@mouldy - thanks for your input!

Deb12 didn't work "out of the box" either. But WeirdTreeThing on GitHub has a script that does 2 things (that i am aware of)

a) it installs a "chultrabook kernel" (but at last check this part of the script was broken - so it had to be manually upgraded"

b) it would install one of two firmware updates - I linked part of the script that seemed (maybe) relevant (to me) in an earlier post. - but i confess i really don't understand it.

So the challenge for me is how to replicate the process. Everything i seem to read say's there's something in kernel versions higher than 6.4 that allow the firmware/drivers to work. But does it need tweaking for a chromebook? Will it work under puppy? can any 6.4+ kernel work? I'm am TOTALLY unqualified and ignorant in these arenas.

Off to work now. I'll try to check in when i get home later tonight (EST).

There are people on the forum that know far more about kernels than I do, but think it depends on how the kernel was compiled and what modules/options were picked when compiling. Sometimes stuff is left out to keep size of kernel smaller. And newer kernels tend to support newer hardware. I believe there are available optional compiled kernels for download that will work in Puppy. The ones with everything including the kitchen sink are much larger. I am not the person to ask on this.

Special kernels for chromebooks probably have options chosen for hardware common to chromebooks without everything including the kitchen sink.

[wizard]

@clm1919

Will it work under puppy?

Sometimes you just gotta bang rocks

wizard

[clm1919]

Special kernels for chromebooks probably have options chosen for hardware common to chromebooks without everything including the kitchen sink.

Is there any way for me to identify such a "for chromebooks" kernel in the Puppy kernel list?

WeirdTreeThing on GitHub mentioned

Using kernel 6.6 or newer is the preferred solution, since that's when my patch landed that selects the correct driver automatically.

I don't know enough about kernels-stuff. I'm assuming that he's referring to HIS repository - which i ASSUME aren't going to work with puppy, based on comments made earlier in this thread.

[clm1919]

@clm1919

Will it work under puppy?

Sometimes you just gotta bang rocks

wizard

I agree. Just asking for a little advice. perhaps i put too many options in earlier post....I'd make a terrible research scientist.
@wizard
@bigpup
@mikewalsh
@mikeslr
@ozsouth

Let me start with this: I have two working micro-SD cards now and tested both. Fresh installs, only things added are Barrier and git.
a) FAT32/EXT4
b) JUST FAT32

would it be advantageous to test a kernel upgrade on each? (hey it didn't work on "card A", but it might work on "card B")

Or should i format/partition them the same? are there issues (that I am ignorant of) that would make one setup or the other in-advisable?

[mikewalsh]

@clm1919 :-

I'm NO expert with this stuff. But if that was me, I'd stick with the FAT32/ext4-formatted card. Simple reason is that all Chromebooks have always been UEFI rather than MBR - I believe this was one of Google's stipulations to manufacturers when the specs originally came out.......and Google themselves use ext4 for the main 'system' partition when you do an install (like when I installed ChromeOS-Reflex.)

.....along with about a million tiny little partitions that gParted doesn't even recognise, but.....I digress..!

Wait for advice from the others before committing yourself one way or the other.

Mike.

[bigpup]

I agree, use the FAT32/ext4-formatted card.

That is really the best way to setup one for UEFI bios computers.
The only stuff you ever want to have on the fat32 1st partition is the boot loader and it's files.

Plus the Puppy frugal install on the ext4 partition, can use a save folder. It works like any folder and can use any amount of free space on the partition, as needed.

The SD card that is one partition formatted fat32.
Fat32 format can only use a save file and fat32 has a max file size limit of 4GB.

[clm1919]

@bigpup
@mikewalsh

Thanks so much for those comments. (yeah, i went and wiki-ed UEFI - now it's no longer a "cryptic magic word" - this is how out-of-date my skills are)

.....and fat32 has a max file size limit of 4GB.

while I "knew" that (once upon a time) it didn't "click" in terms of this project.

these are the kind of tiny things that make me feel like a "rock banging linux-neanderthal!!!" But I'm evolving....slowly.

TO THE BAT-COFFEE MACHINE chums!!

Then to clone the FAT32/ext4 SD card and then perhaps to stare at long lists of puppy linux kernels.

[clm1919]

So i made an *.img backup of the Fat32/Ext4 micro-SD card. I haven't yet cloned it over to the "other" card.

While that was going on I did some reading, watched some video's, all re: linux/chromebooks

and I stared at the list of linux kernels until my eyes glazed over

and these seem the most recent:

huge-6.9.1-fossapup64.tar.bz2................05-Jun-2024 (152.6M)
huge-6.9.4-slac64oz-hf-aoe.tar.bz2........16-Jun-2024 (44.6M)
huge-6.9.4-ubun64oz-hf-aoe.tar.bz2.......16-Jun-2024 (44.6M)
huge-6.9.7-x86_64.tar.bz2.......................06-Jul-2024 (114.3M)
huge-6.9.9-64oz-hf-aoum.tar.bz2............16-Jul-2024 (44.7M)

@mikewalsh
@wizard
@bigpup
@mikeslr
@mouldy

SO....I'm assuming - and please correct me if I'm wrong

• since I'm using BookwormPup64_10.0.7 I don't want a "slac", "fossapup", or "ubun" kernel

• I really REALLY want an "aoum" kernel (yes? right?)

• The larger the file the more "kitchen sink" stuff that is included? (like, maybe, support for intel sound firmware for my CPU)

based on the above (completely ignorant assumptions) - I'd probably want the

-huge-6.9.9-64oz-hf-aoum.tar.bz2

or

-huge-6.9.7-x86_64.tar.bz2 (no "aoum" but more "kitchen sink")

I apologize for dumb-ING it down to cave-man-want-to-smash-rocks speak - but that's where I'm at....ATM.

[bigpup]

For BookwormPup64 10.0.7 you still need to do what ozsouth has posted in this topic:
viewtopic.php?t=12191

The size of the kernel is more about the kernel is getting bigger and bigger with each new version.
Trying to have support for older and newer hardware.
New features, having code that is much bigger in size, so it makes the kernel bigger.

since I'm using BookwormPup64_10.0.7 I don't want a "slac", "fossapup", or "ubun" kernel

Correct these are not made to work in BookwormPup64.

You may want to look at the topics posted in Additional Software ->Kernels
The topic of a specific kernel will provide information you may need to know.

Example topic:
viewtopic.php?t=12175

[clm1919]

<digression>I'm @work, but got a notification - Hey, i helped someone on GitHub!!

https://github.com/WeirdTreeThing/chrom ... issues/152

[bigpup]

So you need no help from us, if you help someone on Github!

Well, we are still here if you need us to help you!

We are Puppy.
Puppy does stuff the Puppy way.
So fixing something in Puppy Linux, is usually very Puppy Linux specific.

ChromeBooks and Puppy Linux providing sound in them, is going to always be an issue.

ChromeBooks seem to be in their own world of what hardware they use.

I am starting to think it is hardware left over, that did not work well in normal computers.

So, the computer manufactures, used it in their ChromeBooks, where they have total control of the Chrome OS, they install in them.
They can totally tweak the Chrome OS to make the hardware work.

[clm1919]

So you need no help from us, if you help someone on Github!

Well, we are still here if you need us to help you!

We are Puppy.
Puppy does stuff the Puppy way.
So fixing something in Puppy Linux, is usually very Puppy Linux specific.

I really appreciate y'all. The help, the smiles, the stories. was just feeling like it was me being all "take take take". Felt really good to be able to help someone (directly) back. got a TINY bit of that feeling when a certain someone decided to try his SD card again in an old machine and it worked. @mikewalsh

after reading all your advice it seems I'll HAVE to edit the grub.cfg if this is going to work (if i understand ozsouth's linked post re: ursmerge/overlayfs)

So i think a few days of looking at grub tutorials is in my future.

*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-
side note/digression/story-warning - had to resize a partition on my Old-broken-screen win10/deb12/puppy laptop yesterday to give more space for linux. Being more comfortable with the Windows method I booted into Win10.

OMFG - after using Puppy/Deb12 on that machine for a while now.....i felt like i was back in the 90's installing win95 with floppy disks on a 386.... I had forgotten that i used to start it up and then go make coffee...

yes - this is why i keep dusting off my linux "skills" every few years. I may still use a windows laptop for work. But i haven't used it for anything else since starting this project....heck, i even installed Steam on the above mentioned deb12 partition. It works, haven't used it much, but it WORKS (and better than under windows...it seems). But now...I think I'm starting to get "converted" thanks to all your help.

[clm1919]

@bigpup
@wizard
@mikewalsh
@mikeslr
@mouldy
@ozsouth
Apologies to those who have invested a lot of time into this thread and helping me understand "the puppy way" a little better, but between a wedding and some other personal stuff i haven't had time to play with Grub or puppy for a while.

But in my casual research I did run into something new (to me) called Ventoy.

I used it to combine 7 of my live USB's into one (including a fresh puppy, keeping the old one, but nice to have another puppy bootable usb).

I haven't tried to install puppy with the new usb, but everything booted, except one rescue disk image (not UFEI compatible or something).

• It seems like a nifty tool, but i was curious if any of you guys had thoughts on it.

• would using it cause issues with puppy? does it work with "the puppy way"?

• Is it remotely possible to do something similar with Grub2?

I appreciate every post - I hope using the "@" mention thing isn't spam....if it is, PLEASE say so.

[mikewalsh]

@clm1919 :-

Heh. Oh, we know ALL about Ventoy. At least one member here thinks it's the best thing that ever happened for distro-hoppers....

viewtopic.php?t=8677

Me, I've tried it.......and personally, I can't see what all the fuss is about. But then, my distro-hopping days are pretty much over; I found 'the one for ME' a LONG time ago..! And for the rare occasions when I want to try out a new Puppy, I prefer a bare-metal install.....which takes less than 5 minutes, including modifying the bootloader.

I WILL agree, it's a good tool for those who are still in the early stages of their "love-affair" with Linux.

Mike.

[wizard]

@clm1919

Ventoy is a great tool and I use it often, not only for many Pups, but also for other Linux distros like MX and PrimeOS. Additionally, mine contains major system tools like Hiren BootCD, Rescuezilla and Memtest86.

Forum member @Clarity is our resident Ventoy champion and has done much to promote its understanding and use.

Thanks
wizard

[clm1919]

@mikewalsh

Thanks for that link mike - oh boy, another rabbit-hole to explore

I suppose i should have done a search of the forums for Ventoy instead of spamming everyone w/ the "@" - apologizes.

While i like both Deb12 and puppy I realize I'm so far behind in the Linux "scene" I sometimes want to go look and see "what all the fuss is about" with other desktops (and distro's). I'm not sure Ventoy is the best thing since sliced bread yet, i just "discovered" it- and it's reduced the clutter on my desk considerably which is an ADHD dream.

now if it could only wash coffee mugs....

@wizard (who posted while i was struggling to write this post un-cafinated). - thanks for reminding me - i need to get Memtest86 on there (and now look into Rescuezilla).

Yeah, i spent an hour trying to follow some of @Clarity 's posts down the rabbit-hole before wanting to "get up" this morning. (it's MikesW's fault *heart*)

[mikeslr]

Just scanning thru this thread to see what's happening so saw your post here, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 47#p126747 about your effort to obtain sound even when using a chultrabook kernel, noting "b) it would install one of two firmware updates".

Just a thought. Both Drivers and Firmware are needed to communicate with hardware. Drivers are 'Kernel-specific': that is they have to be compiled under the kernel to be used. But firmware is not.

Because of the way Puppy's work --modular, 'run-in-RAM', Save Changes to a SaveFile/Folder etc.-- Puppy's kernels (and associated drivers) have to be specifically compiled. I don't know how to modify a chultrabook kernel to work with Puppys; but suspect it's an uphill task. However, if what you need is the correct firmware, all you have to do is find it, download it, and copy it to the correct location where your Puppy will find it.

IIRC, you are now working with Bookworm. For it, the correct location for firmware is (I think) /usr/lib/firmware. [I think all Puppys will also look into that folder even if it generally uses a different one, e.g. /lib/firmware].

So to obtain sound if a kernel for Bookworm provides the driver but not the firmware you may be able to download the chultrabook firmware, extract it --using UExtract-- and copy the extracted contents into /usr/lib/firmware.

[Clarity]

... Yeah, i spent an hour trying to follow some of @Clarity's posts down the rabbit-hole before wanting to "get up" this morning.

Please post any problems or recommendations that will improve user use of directions where you are getting lost. Post them on any of the threads where the instructions could better be presented.

Looking to improve the instructions so that any user can setup there ISOs and their sessions folders for succcessful use with ALL forum distros.

The intent remains to be a simple download an "ISO file to boot it with no need to extract" allowing anyone to get to an operational desktop with sessions being saved as expected.

Anything or ideas to improve the instructions are helpful to all members.

[clm1919]

Oh, I'm pretty sure the directions are perfectly clear to people who are literate in Linux-ese

I'm getting better at it, but i sometimes wish google translate had an option for Linux-ese to Caveman.

[bigpup]

About getting sound in BookwormPup64 10.0.7

Other people report it just working on their ChromeBooks.

So I am wondering if you are setting up sound properly when you do the first boot of BookwormPup64.

On right side of the desktop tray is a speaker icon.

Right click on it and select preferences.

This is where settings can be done to get sound working.

To first see if it is even seeing the sound hardware.

Click on the Output Devices tab.

Are any devices listed????

If yes.

What are they?? List all so I can see what the options are to select.

I can tell you what to select to use and how to select it.

[clm1919]

@bigpup

So I am wondering if you are setting up sound properly when you do the first boot of BookwormPup64.

I confess anything is possible. and before i came here i had tried <and probably broken>. many things banging scripts and trying to install firmware.
-----------------------------------

1. Booting from the SD-card Frugal install (ALMOST virgin install only changes - git and barrier installed)

2. booting from the brand new ventoy usb (no saves or installs)

I get the same results as below for both

On right side of the desktop tray is a speaker icon.

Right click on it and select preferences.

I get the what looks like the "PulseAudio Volume Control"

Click on the Output Devices tab.

Are any devices listed?

It lists only "dummy output" - no hardware output devices detected.

---------------------------
--->when i go to the last tab (configuration) "built-inAudio" is there, but the profile is set to "OFF"
The Profile options in the pull-down menu are:

• ProAudio

• ...a long list of (HDMI) options that all have the tag (unplugged) (unavailable)

This model doesn't have an HDMI port.

When i select the "pro-audio" the "output devices" shows hardware options-

• built-in-audio-pro

• built-in-audio-pro 7

• built-in-audio-pro 8

none of these result in any sound from speakers or the microphone jack if i click the different checkboxes.

I posted some of this in a long-rambling post earlier in the thread: viewtopic.php?p=126054&sid=42231ac2d7ab ... ea#p126054

[clm1919]

@mikeslr THANK YOU FOR THAT POST! I hope my reply makes sense.

Just scanning thru this thread to see what's happening so saw your post here, https://www.forum.puppylinux.com/viewto ... 47#p126747 about your effort to obtain sound even when using a chultrabook kernel, noting "b) it would install one of two firmware updates".

Just a thought. Both Drivers and Firmware are needed to communicate with hardware. Drivers are 'Kernel-specific': that is they have to be compiled under the kernel to be used. But firmware is not.

Because of the way Puppy's work --modular, 'run-in-RAM', Save Changes to a SaveFile/Folder etc.-- Puppy's kernels (and associated drivers) have to be specifically compiled. I don't know how to modify a chultrabook kernel to work with Puppys; but suspect it's an uphill task. However, if what you need is the correct firmware, all you have to do is find it, download it, and copy it to the correct location where your Puppy will find it.

I like the last part (and think i understand it - i'm slowly getting there)

I had found this a while back on the intel website (my cpu is the n3350)
audo-firmware-blah-blah-n3350-processor-on-yocto-project

I'm not sure what the phrase "on-yocto-project" means but the *zip file has a *tar and some documentation. There are some *.bin files in the "driver" folder.... and some *.blob files (dunno what those are). -

I (honestly) tried reading some of the included documentation but i got lost real fast.

IIRC, you are now working with Bookworm.

yes - the BookwormPup64_10.0.7

For it, the correct location for firmware is (I think) /usr/lib/firmware. [I think all Puppys will also look into that folder even if it generally uses a different one, e.g. /lib/firmware].

earlier in the thread i posed some parts of the script i used to get it working under Debian, but now that i know more i think the relevant part is

# Install sof firmware
if not path_exists("/lib/firmware/intel/sof"):
print_status("Installing SOF firmware")
install_package("sof-firmware", "firmware-sof-signed", "alsa-sof-firmware", "sof-firmware", "sof-firmware")

but nothing in that intel driver_firmware pack has anything that looks like the above (and i still don't know what a BLOB file is except that it's a way to store binary data)

So to obtain sound if a kernel for Bookworm provides the driver but not the firmware you may be able to download the chultrabook firmware, extract it --using UExtract-- and copy the extracted contents into /usr/lib/firmware.

New Homework - read up on UExtract. - THANK YOU mikeslr - another long work day for me today, but i will read up a bit and (hopefully) try it tomorrow.

[bigpup]

Click on the Output Devices tab.

Are any devices listed?

It lists only "dummy output" - no hardware output devices detected.

---------------------------
--->when i go to the last tab (configuration) "built-inAudio" is there, but the profile is set to "OFF"
The Profile options in the pull-down menu are:

ProAudio

...a long list of (HDMI) options that all have the tag (unplugged) (unavailable)

This model doesn't have an HDMI port.

When i select the "pro-audio" the "output devices" shows hardware options-

built-in-audio-pro

built-in-audio-pro 7

built-in-audio-pro 8

none of these result in any sound from speakers or the microphone jack if i click the different checkboxes.

You are guessing at what to do instead of waiting for suggestions after posting the results.
The Pulse Audio setup is confusing.
It needs to be used in specific steps in a specific order.

[bigpup]

--->when i go to the last tab (configuration) "built-inAudio" is there, but the profile is set to "OFF"
The Profile options in the pull-down menu are:

ProAudio

Correct select that.

When i select the "pro-audio" the "output devices" shows hardware options-

built-in-audio-pro

built-in-audio-pro 7

built-in-audio-pro 8

none of these result in any sound from speakers or the microphone jack if i click the different checkboxes.

Did you mean speakers and headphone jack?

To see exactly what it shows.

The output devices tab.
In the built-in-audio-pro listed
It does or does not have a port entry under it?
At far right, Is the green check mark clicked on one time by you, only one time? Sorry it gives no indication you did this or not.
This selects it as default device to use.
Also make sure the mute button is not selected. (looks like speaker with a red X). If selected, it kind of grays out the other buttons, and the listing.
If it does get selected and then selected again to not mute. Click on the green check mark button again, to make sure it is back to being default device.

If it does not have a port entry and the speakers are internal on the computer.
Look on the keyboard for something that could be used to turn speakers off/on.
If something is there try using it to turn them on.

Then restart the preferences selection and see if Output Devices ->built-in-audio-pro has now a port entry with maybe speakers in it.

Do not try anything else until I read your results.

Note:
Whatever program you use to test sound working.
It has settings for the device to use, that also needs to be set to the same device.